Need programmer.

Thread Starter

kiyoukan

Joined Nov 17, 2009
63
Ohh dont worry i will i am going to etch my board before i go and put the thing into the board run.
That way i will have a working unit.
My etching wont be production quality but it will at least let me have a near identical version.
just got to get the layout first.
 

t06afre

Joined May 11, 2009
5,934
From what I can see your design use little power. It could be that you can power it by using the USB port. Up to about 100mA this will not be a problem.
You are saying you are using the HD44780. I guess you mean a LCD with a HD44780 onboard? Because a HD44780 is just a LCD driver chip. That are embedded on many LCD displays.
 

maxpower097

Joined Feb 20, 2009
816
Ohh dont worry i will i am going to etch my board before i go and put the thing into the board run.
That way i will have a working unit.
My etching wont be production quality but it will at least let me have a near identical version.
just got to get the layout first.
If times that big of a deal I would say breadboard it out with DIP chips then convert over the breadboard to your final run or etch. PCB etching is an art unto itself, so I think just skipping that part would probably be the best solution. You can buy each chip in a different package. So you can buy all DIP chips to breadboard, prototype, even make your own protoboard and solder them in. Then ones thats programmed and all working your order the SMT versions of the same chips and have them professionally printed so you won't run into any crazy problems, also if your gonna do a big run consider contacting china to find a firm that will make the whole board for you and solder on all the parts too. So you just get delivered working boards.
 

Thread Starter

kiyoukan

Joined Nov 17, 2009
63
Well as far as the etching goes i already got a whole lab full of stuff to do it, i see no reason not to use it. I find proto board to be more of a pain to work with.
I have etched many boards and can get good small traces.
And if the first 50 units sell quickly i will indeed look at the option of having them come pre made.
But also i do have access to a re flow oven and a hot air solder iron as well as a fine tip soldering iron.
and yes i will be using a lcd with the chip on board.
78L05 would be no problem.
i also like the idea of using pads for the programing than having a header. that way it looks better and saves a tiny bit of time and money.
i dont doubt that this schematic will work, i think enough people have looked it over and gave it the okay. it will now be up to my programing and my software guy to get it to work right.
i am hoping to on friday to place and order for most of the parts.
Seeing even if the schematic has to change the chips and headers and switches usb opamps and pots will still be there.
That way i can work it out and get it running very fast.
I sometimes just have to take a chance, my chance will be that this is right or enough that it wont take much reworking that will need magically different parts.
i also attached the file i have been working on. that way you can take a closer look. in case there is something those images dont show.
but so far so good.
And on the layout i want the lcd and board to connect via headers. kinda like a shield. and then have the button below the lcd.
I might have some free time tonight to try to do a layout but i will need a good amount of help with what traces should be wider to help reduce noise and other such things. there seem to be alot of rules about traces and how thick/long to be that i have no idea.
and yes i do plan to use the usb to power this thing. the battery is only there for when its going to be used without the computer.
I thought about making a version with out the lcd but they are so cheap and add alot of value to the project.
 

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thatoneguy

Joined Feb 19, 2009
6,359
For PCB Design:
The only leads to watch the length on would be the lines from the op amp outputs to the ADC, keep oscillator very close to PIC, and the 0.1uF decoupling caps close to the power pins on the ICs.

The LCD and PIC external signals in this application are running at low frequencies and current, to the point where they operate fine on a solderless breadboard. There shouldn't be any other layout problems, as the completed board will be rather small. Designing it with the minimal number of jumpers or vias is a rule for any PCB once other conditions are met (capacitor and trace length).

All lines will be VERY low current, so a good ground plane, mid width, say 0.1" +5V bus and good decoupling (power supply filtering) are the only things I would deem "necessary" for this project. I'd also suggest using the USB power to run the entire board unless it needs to run in standalone mode as well as connected to a PC.

More complex PCB layouts are needed when running in the many Mhz range on the lines external to the processor. Routing and lengths to make sure bits arrive at the same time, matching impedances, etc, which this application doesn't have.
 

Thread Starter

kiyoukan

Joined Nov 17, 2009
63
So with the above stated rules, how much time and money do you think it would cost get get the layout done?
Also just for clarification by 0.1uF decoupling caps you mean the caps on the lm7805 correct? or all of the caps keep them close?
 

thatoneguy

Joined Feb 19, 2009
6,359
So with the above stated rules, how much time and money do you think it would cost get get the layout done?
Also just for clarification by 0.1uF decoupling caps you mean the caps on the lm7805 correct? or all of the caps keep them close?
There should be a 0.1uF cap across the supply pins of the uC, possibly the op amps as well to prevent digital noise in the op amps, and prevent glitches in the uC.

Look in the tacked resources area, I believe there are a few free programs for creating PCBoards around, I'm not sure which is the best, others here may have input, or a forum search may result in some good information.
 

Thread Starter

kiyoukan

Joined Nov 17, 2009
63
okay so i have been talking to my software and other people and it comes to find out i have no need for switches.
As long as i can program with out a switch i am fine.
I cant honestly remember why i even added switches.
With the subtraction of the switches that lowered the cost and size a great deal the board is coming down to a size around 1.5in by 1.5in.
and at 5$ a square inch for 3 boards. so all in all these boards will cost 3.75$ roughly. Now i am using express pcb to attemp layout as it is free. but i need some serious help with doing traces i keep getting them confused.
i will attach and image and the file to get a better reference.
Also i would not like to use a usb type b connector as it is to big. i think i want to use a standard usb but it is not in the component database. does anyone know how where to get one? right now i am just going to try to make a mock version off some schematics. but i was hoping to find a real one.
and that .brd file is actually a .pcb file but i had to rename to upload.
apparently you cant upload pcb files....
pcblpm.brd is also a pcb file but i changed the position of some parts for faster access to pots
 

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