Multisim - 4060N isn't oscillating

Discussion in 'General Electronics Chat' started by Huby, Aug 19, 2012.

  1. Huby

    Thread Starter New Member

    Jul 5, 2012
    24
    1
    If i connect function generator to test the oscillation everything works OK but if i connect 3mhz osc to pin 10 and 11 of 4060 there's no signal. According to datasheet 10 and 11 are input pins for osc and they are connected with MOhm resistor. Btw this is working in "real" pcb.

    Can someone check if this part is working.
    I tested it on new design and on original schematics.

    Maybe i need to set some instructions to quartz osc ?.. Just guessing .

    Huby
     
  2. bertus

    Administrator

    Apr 5, 2008
    15,649
    2,348
    Hello,

    Can you post a schematic?

    Bertus
     
  3. Wendy

    Moderator

    Mar 24, 2008
    20,766
    2,536
    Show the schematic, otherwise we are working in the dark.
     
  4. Huby

    Thread Starter New Member

    Jul 5, 2012
    24
    1
    I will pass whole schematics.
    There should be signal on IGBT's but there's none so i was testing on 4060N.

    I tested few options ( maybe the last one is wrong ) and this one should work according to datasheet.

    10 , 11 --> to osc
    12 --> gnd
    16 -->vss ( 12V )
    OSC = 3mhz - quarz
    ---------------------
    Output should be 200hz.
    Final goal is to get signal / impuls on TC4220.

    Huby
     
  5. MrChips

    Moderator

    Oct 2, 2009
    12,451
    3,370
    What happened to pin-8 to GND?
    Did you connect a 10MΩ resistor across the XTAL and two 15-22pF to GND?
     
  6. Huby

    Thread Starter New Member

    Jul 5, 2012
    24
    1
    Pin 8 and pin 16 are automaticly set and you can not change them.
    Ok, you can set different voltage to pin 16.
    Pin 16 is by default VDD and 8 is VSS also by default.
    They are both hidden pins and i can not "edit " them.

    I dont understand you why should i need 15pF cap ?
    If this is really neccessery, i can not set it because pin 8 is "blocked" for editing.

    Please look at multisim test schematics ( this is just one of the tests ).

    http://oi50.tinypic.com/z669z.jpg

    Huby
     
  7. bertus

    Administrator

    Apr 5, 2008
    15,649
    2,348
    Hello,

    As said before, do you use the loading capacitors?

    Here is a picture from the datasheet:

    [​IMG]

    Bertus
     
  8. Huby

    Thread Starter New Member

    Jul 5, 2012
    24
    1
    I try it just now.
    It the same as before....
    Can you test it ?
     
  9. Huby

    Thread Starter New Member

    Jul 5, 2012
    24
    1
    Well, this is newest situation.
    I change to the 4060BT ( not BD ) 15V and i test it on separate design. It works as it should.
    Then i put the same part into my existing schematics and, you guess it... it doesn't work. To be more precise, it starts to oscillate but there is no signal. I disconnected it from 4040 and i test it alone ( on whole schematics ) and the situation is the same. It starts to oscillate but there no signal. I also try with capacitors to gnd, but nothing.

    Is this kind of schematics to heavy for multisim ?
    If so, then where can i find some better program to simulate my schematics ?

    Huby
     
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2012
  10. absf

    Senior Member

    Dec 29, 2010
    1,493
    373
    I simulated your circuit on the 4060 on proteus and it also doesn't work. It works if I inject the 3 Mhz pulses directly onto the pin.

    I also dont know the reason why..... But in the past I have simulated 2 transistors connected as a multi-vibrating oscillator and it didnt work as well.

    Have you tried it on LTSpice IV yet? I guess some circuits are difficult to simulate and have to be tested on real hardware....

    Allen
     
  11. Huby

    Thread Starter New Member

    Jul 5, 2012
    24
    1
    I was thinking how should this work in isis but as you pointed out, it would not work.

    It works if I inject the 3 Mhz pulses directly onto the pin.
    ** Over function generator or ?

    Can you please test my whole schematics on this way.
    I will do the same...

    I was working with ltspice before but i didn't use it on this schematics.
    Did you use LTspice for such projects and if you did can you compare it to multisim ( on efficiency level :))

    Huby
    p.s. whole schematics is few post up and you have to move osc connection to pin 11 ( my mistake ).
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2012
  12. Huby

    Thread Starter New Member

    Jul 5, 2012
    24
    1
    Any luck with testing the schematics ?

    Huby
     
  13. absf

    Senior Member

    Dec 29, 2010
    1,493
    373
    It only works in the way as attached in ISIS....

    And I can only get it to work down to 1 MHz clock.

    I seldom use LTSpice but it was good for transporting design amongst the members here and other groups. My LTSpice also dont have 4060 on my '4000 cmos library". I've never used multisim as well.

    Allen
     
  14. Huby

    Thread Starter New Member

    Jul 5, 2012
    24
    1
    You connected just to rtc ?
    Dont you need pin 10,11 and resistor?

    I will try it today....
     
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