Motor direction control

Discussion in 'The Projects Forum' started by cybertronics, Sep 3, 2009.

  1. cybertronics

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Aug 29, 2009
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    HI

    I been looking for a circuit like Sqt Wookie to use for my project where you can push 1button to made a motor turn in one direction up then push second2 button in the other direct down.

    Sqt wooKie:
    Can you tell me the relays YOU have in that circuit are they normally closed for RELAY 1 then switch To N.O. or the other way AROUND N.O. THEN N.C.
    AND HOW ABOUT RELAY 2

    ALSO ARE THESE RELAYS 12VDC INPUT AND 12VDC OUTPUT AT 1A OR 10As

    what are the specs for those limit switches.

    thanks
     
  2. cybertronics

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Aug 29, 2009
    46
    0
    Sqt wookie

    forgot to mention for the relays can i get them at my local RADIO SHACK STORE and what would you recommend and part number also

    i hope you can help.

    THANKS
     
  3. beenthere

    Retired Moderator

    Apr 20, 2004
    15,815
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    Welcome to AAC

    You might think about opening a thread with each new question. It can be confusing if your topic is pasted on the end of a several month old topic that has closed - http://forum.allaboutcircuits.com/showthread.php?t=23640

    It might help if you told us what resource you have available. What is the motor type, what voltage and current, what control voltage you have, etc.
     
  4. cybertronics

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Aug 29, 2009
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    Hi beenthere

    I'm new to this forum.

    I did not know that you can't reopen older topics or add to it. I would of started a new topic for a project I'm working on that is similar to this topic-
    http://forum.allaboutcircuits.com/sh...ad.php?=23640


    What i want to know is what relay sqt wookie used in his daigram and specs.
    but if you think its best too open a new thread or a similar topic i will do that.
     
  5. cybertronics

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Aug 29, 2009
    46
    0
    Hi

    I'am new to this forum. So all help is greatly apperciated.

    I'm a electronics hobbyist with basic- intermediate level electronics back ground so i could read and take a circuit daigram and build from them and design just basic circuits,this is why i been looking for a circuit design that i could use in my project.

    I been searching for a motor polarity control circuit on the world wide web that i could use in my project.By doing a search i came across this circuit on allaboutcircuits forum called motor control here's the link.

    http://forum.allaboutcircuits.com/sh...ad.php?t=23640

    This circuit in reference is drawn up by Sqt Wookie , i think this circuit would work for me for my project. I like to know if i could use this Circuit!

    But here's a little about what i want to do.

    I would like to made my plexy glass/wood combination cover lid on my planter box open up/down with a 12vdc motor control circuit so i don"t have to attend to it often it will be temperature controlled, but if i need to open or close it manually i would have this option to do so by using two momentary push button switches 1 for up 2 for down manually operating the lid by opening and closing the cover this is where this push button circuirt by Sqt Wookies comes in to play.

    My lid will open manually when i push switch (1) from 0 to 90deg then stop at 90 degrees hold its position until switch (2) is push bring the lid back down to where it started.The lid weights apoxx 8-10lbs so i need a high torque motor but which runs smoothy in both directions and quiet.The link for the motor is below, i think this motor could work.There's three comments where they use this motor for high torque applications this is why i think this motor could work for lifting my lid cover.
    http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a-store/item/DCM-276/5-RPM-GEAR-MOTOR-12VDC/-/1.html

    Can anybody tell me,
    The relays in Sqt Wookies circuit are they wired N.O.to N.C. or N.C to N.O.
    The relays that are SPDT 12vdc input is the output also 12vdc and what is the current ratings for these relays is it 1A OR 10As


    Can someone help me get my project up and working.

    PS> Sqt Wookie if you read my thread basic on the circuit you use in another topic can you help.

    Thanks.
     
  6. cybertronics

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Aug 29, 2009
    46
    0
    can any body HELP!
     
  7. SgtWookie

    Expert

    Jul 17, 2007
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    Sorry, I didn't see this thread. Haven't had much time to spend on the board lately.
    This is the circuit you were referring to:
    [​IMG]

    The relays are generic single-pole, double-throw relays. Their NC state is shown in the schematic. When energized, the NC side opens and the NO side closes.

    In the schematic, the power supply was 12.6v. I simply used relays from the simulation library that had coils rated for 12VDC. The library relays are capable of withstanding nearly infinite current at nearly infinite voltage. However, for "real world" relays, you would only need select relays that had an appropriate coil voltage and type (AC or DC) rating that was appropriate for your application, and contact ratings that were more than the voltage your load required, and preferably at least twice the current rating for long life.

    The limit switches only need to be rated for the current and voltage required of the relay coil.
     
  8. SgtWookie

    Expert

    Jul 17, 2007
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    I have no idea what motor you intend to power with the relays, or the voltage supply you are using, or the current requirements.

    As of right now, all I can suggest is that you need a relay that has SPDT contacts with voltage and current ratings suitable for your application.

    [eta]
    OK, finally read your long post with a link to the motor.

    I'm not optimistic that the motor you have selected will have a very long life. It's designed to drive a lightweight flap in the air conditioning/heating duct of an automobile/truck.

    A 12v relay with contacts rated for 1A and at least 12v will be enough for your application.
    This could work: http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062481

    As far as limit switches; all they need to be able to do is be normally closed, but open up when the motor is supposed to stop. The type of switch you choose will be dictated by the mechanical layout. However, you might consider something like this:
    http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2049719

    Radio Shack is a very expensive place to buy components. You would be money ahead if you ordered parts from a supplier like http://www.Digikey.com - they are hobbyist-friendly.
     
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2009
  9. cybertronics

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Aug 29, 2009
    46
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    Thanks Sqt Wookie for replying to my thead.

    I new you would be the best person to respond based on the circuit you provide in that other thread that you reply to.

    The voltage for my application is 12vdc current about 200mA, RELAYS are the same voltage 12vdc.The power supply will be from a AC outlet wall adapter 120ac to 12vdc at 500mA.

    That motor that was to be use in my application was suggested to do the fact it has high torque.And you could be right it might have a short operating life but i been trying to find a motor with metal gears and high torque to lift the 10lbs that i need but i don't know to much on picking the best type for my project

    Can you recommend or know of high torque motor from www.allelectronic.com that would work best for me and can buy cheap for under $10-$15 to use in my project. Because I really don't know what motor type that would work best for my application it must be 12vdc and one that has a high torque output to lift a 10lb lid and that will run quiet with low inrush current.

    thanks
     
  10. cybertronics

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Aug 29, 2009
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    Forgot to mention YES thats the CIRCUIT.

    Also if you don't see a suitable motor from allelectronics you think might not work do you have a recommendation fron another supplier. or a part number.

    P.S. Sorry for the long Post I got carried away.

    Thanks
     
  11. SgtWookie

    Expert

    Jul 17, 2007
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    A quick glance through their inventory didn't show anything that meets all of your criteria.

    Just try it with the motor you've already selected.
     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2009
  12. cybertronics

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Aug 29, 2009
    46
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    I will do that.But If that motor i already have dose not work than what could i use. Or if the motor in the below link is not a good motor or you think its not suitable then what would you recommend.A PART number would be appreciated.

    I fund this motor at allelectronics its a windshield wiper motor it might be overkill for my application. but It could work, what do you think will this work or not with the specs i need. And its priced right.
    https://www.allelectronics.com/index.php?&page=item&id=DCM-249&index=1

    thanks
     
  13. SgtWookie

    Expert

    Jul 17, 2007
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    It's too fast, and it has integrated electronics that would make it difficult to use with your project.
     
  14. cybertronics

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Aug 29, 2009
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    http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a-store/item/DCM-326/POWERFUL-DC-MOTOR-W/-GEARBOX/1.html

    I found this motor at allelectronics would this work for me or is this motor to a overkill in speed its also 12VDC. If not.
    CAN YOU TELL me what i should be looking for AND NEED in a motor thats 12VDC IN THE specifications for my application like minium and maxium RPM, operating and maxium current,inrush current and load current. So i could search for the right motor.

    THANKS
     
  15. cybertronics

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Aug 29, 2009
    46
    0
    http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a...GEARBOX/1.html
    would this motor work for me or is this motor too an overkill in speed, its also 12VDC. If this is not a suitable motor too use.
    CAN YOU TELL ME what i should be looking for AND WOULD NEED in a motor thats 12VDC IN THE specifications for my application and what type of motor with the minium and maxium RPMs, operating and maxium current,inrush current and load current so i could search for the right motor, this way I'm not coming back just to ask you would this motor be right to use everytime i find a motor that might work.

    I know you don't have the time to look for a motor for me this is why Im asking if you could give me the type of motor and specifications to look for in a suitable motor to use in my project.This would help alot in finding a suitable motor.

    Also I need too know in the circuit diagram is the limit switches Com pin connected to the coil and the normally closed pin connected to GND OR Com pin connected too coil and normally open pin connected to GND. I want too be right on this.

    I'm Also a big beliver in making a circuit as simple and functional as possible and easy to build and for troubleshooting without adding unnessary compoenets but i like to know (Sqt Wookie) do i need a 12v voltage regulator in this circuit for optimal voltage performance and motor performance so the voltage dose not drift down to a low voltage.also would a inline fuse be wise to add if so can you add this too the circuit diagram for me for that added protection.This circuit as stated will be powered off a 120vac to 12vdc wall adapter so any added protection and safety would be great and being safe is always wise to implement in any circuit and for my safety would be apperciated!

    THANKS
     
  16. SgtWookie

    Expert

    Jul 17, 2007
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    Whether it would work or not is rather moot, as they are sold out of that item.
    Well, basically you have said that you have a lid which weighs 10 lbs that you want to move or open and close using a noiseless motor and a 200mA 12v wall-wart power supply, and you do not want to spend more than $15 on a surplus motor to do so.

    That is really not much to go on.

    The schematic I posted is really quite simple, and does not have very many components - only three per motor terminal. If you want heavier-duty relays, you could get some from an auto parts store. Those will carry quite a bit of current and will last a long time.

    If you want a heavy duty motor that will be quiet, you could go to a junkyard and salvage a window motor and lift mechanism out of something like a small Buick. However, you will need a more capable power supply.
     
  17. Steve C

    Active Member

    Nov 29, 2008
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    How do you plan to add temperature control? Via microcontroller? If so, wouldn't it be easier to buy a servo motor? The control system would be easy, there are TONS of ways to set up both lid position and methods to contorl lid position. That would run off 12 volts and if sourcing parts off the internet I would imagine you'll find a good servo in the budget.

    Sorry for the dumb questions, but I have another. You can design your mechanics so that the lid is not held fast by the motor horn but rather pushed up. Just as if there were a person in your planter pushing up on the lid. Why not design your lift mechanism this way? Manual control wouldn't be by button, but by hand. Loses the cool factor, but gets the job done with no fuss.
     
  18. cybertronics

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Aug 29, 2009
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    Sqt Wookie.

    I will be using that circuit. I also found a similar circuit like the one you posted in a datasheet on relays it seems to be the exact circuit without the limit switches.I'am sure either circuit will work for my application.

    The current i need for lifting the lid is only what the motor needs to put out or the current for the relays which could be 1A the relay that you suggested from Radio shack as I ask is 1A But if i need more CURRENT I did find a relay that will work it is an automotive type relay that has a rating of 20A MAX. I don't i would need more them 1A in a motor TO LIFT a lid thats 10lbs.

    the circuit i found and the circuit you post is not a problem to use in my project.

    Its finding the motor that would be suitable to lift the 10lbs that i need is the problem locating one.

    Will that window motor be too fast for what i need.because speed is not needed this is why I wanted to know whats a suitable RPM,operating current and load current should i be looking for in a motor to lift a 10lb lid that would run on 12vdc.
    why would i need a more capable power supply dosen't a car window run off of the car battery which is 12vDC. correct! And I'm thing it runs under 1A.

    THE WALL ADAPTER is 500mA or 0.5A. not 200mA. The 200mA was suggest for maxium current i might need to operate a 12VDC motor to lift the lid at 10lbs.

    I just wanted to know if the circuit needs a voltage regulator so the voltage dose not drop lower then 12V and a inline fuse to protect the circuit if so can you provide an add circuit diagram in the circuit you posted.
     
  19. cybertronics

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Aug 29, 2009
    46
    0
    Steve

    Yes a servo would be esaier to use with a microcontroller but i could not find a servo motor that could putout 1770 in lbs of torque thats what i would need to lift a 10lb lid.
    1lb would be 5kg at 340 or 360 in lbs of torque. I would need about 4.9 time that torque too lift the lid plus a new servo motor at 360 in lbs of torque is about $24-$30 I couldn't find any motor higher then 550 in lbs of torque.

    As for the temperature control I already have a design that will work in my project.but have not wire it to the system until i find a suitable motor wether it a servo or a reguluar dc motor.

    If you know of a servo motor that will lift a 10lb lid and works quietly and in my price $10-$15 range but i would go as high as $25 if i could find that right servo motor if you know of one or a source post it here.
     
  20. Steve C

    Active Member

    Nov 29, 2008
    86
    0
    I'm not convinced you need such a strong servo. You can counterweight your existing lid for example and seriously reduce your servo requirements. Alternately, you can use mechanical advantage to eliminate some torque requirements. I don't know your lid dimensions, but I'm sure you already know all about how moving your force application point farther from the hinge improves the applied force assuming constant servo torque.
     
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