Momentary to Latched on/off relay problem

Discussion in 'The Projects Forum' started by AUTO, Jul 23, 2014.

  1. AUTO

    Thread Starter New Member

    May 11, 2013
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    Im having an issue with the setup unlatching when the second momentary pulse is applied from the momentary switch. It latches just fine with the initial pulse. The only way to unlatch the setup is to disconnect the switch and swipe the two switch wires together extremely fast. Ive gone through the wiring 3 times and it is wired 100% on with the diagram. Ive seen others post this issue but i haven't seen a solution


    I used the no diodes setup with 5 SPDT relays, second diagram on the page
    http://www.the12volt.com/relays/page5.asp#lsp
     
  2. inwo

    Well-Known Member

    Nov 7, 2013
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    I think I tried that circuit once myself.:(

    Don't remember if it just didn't work or worked poorly.

    See what others might say.

    I'd suggest an impulse relay.
    Also called ratchet relay.

    Or this circuit works with the right relays.

    Edit:

    Using two bosch relays in each position would be no more complicated than other circuit using 5.
    I've found 12V relays willl work if they are unbalanced with a shunt resistance across D1.
     
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2014
  3. AUTO

    Thread Starter New Member

    May 11, 2013
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    Im quite the novice with circuits.

    But I've been looking at a D Flip flop. Looks like a single input with two outputs that toggle with each input maybe. Not quite sure how they operate since most explanations are in terminology above my level of understanding.

    Just saw your edit. Looks like the operation I'm after. Just not to sure exactly what I'm looking at there
     
  4. inwo

    Well-Known Member

    Nov 7, 2013
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    The impulse relay is designed to switch with each button press.

    The circuit shown is another version of the circuit you tried.
    It uses more contacts than a bosch style relay has. So I'm thinking two relays could be used in each position.

    Testing it is more work than I'm willing to do.:(

    I could put some terminal numbers on the diagram if it would help.

    Really suggest finding the right relay, or having someone on here drawing a FF circuit for you.

    You don't have to understand what's going on inside, but you would have to work with smaller parts than you may be accustomed.

    Transistor version.

    [​IMG]
     
  5. AUTO

    Thread Starter New Member

    May 11, 2013
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    can the impulse relay be wired to an existing momentary switch? it looks like the one pictured has its now switch, i HAVE to use the existing built in momentary switch.

    Thanks for your help so far!
     
  6. MaxHeadRoom

    Expert

    Jul 18, 2013
    10,553
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    This is a relay flip flop circuit I have used before.
    Max.
     
  7. AUTO

    Thread Starter New Member

    May 11, 2013
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    Wish I had the slightest clue what that diagram is portraying lol I'm trying to research as much as possible but its a lot to take in. I need a laymans diagram!

    I might try the 4 relay setup with diodes tomorrow just to see if that helps. Like this
    http://www.the12volt.com/relays/relaydiagram23.html
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2014
  8. inwo

    Well-Known Member

    Nov 7, 2013
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  9. Dodgydave

    Distinguished Member

    Jun 22, 2012
    4,998
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    use a 555 timer circuit
     
  10. AUTO

    Thread Starter New Member

    May 11, 2013
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    Is that ebay link a 12v or 120v? The title says 12 but the picture of the info on the side says something about 120
     
  11. djsfantasi

    AAC Fanatic!

    Apr 11, 2010
    2,810
    834
    I didn't see 120 in the pictures; but I did see 12V. The description states that the contacts are rated for 125VAC. I think it's a 12V coil switching 125VAC.
     
  12. inwo

    Well-Known Member

    Nov 7, 2013
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    Can't be too careful on ebay.

    All I see is 12V

    As AC-DC isn't listed, what is it?

    In your case it wouldn't matter. Momentary use!

    They don't show up too often.;)
     
  13. inwo

    Well-Known Member

    Nov 7, 2013
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    How did that work out?:)
    Serious, haven't seen a successful application yet.
    It may work fine.

    I could translate Max's schematic to picture. Even to multiple bosch relays.
    It would still be overly complex.:eek:
    At least you know his works.
    Go with the 555 or the ratchet.
     
  14. AUTO

    Thread Starter New Member

    May 11, 2013
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    It didnt work any better, had the same result. I dont know why those diagrams are posted if they dont work worth a darn.

    I just ordered the one linked to ebay. Maybe ill look into the 555 as a back up

    Can you purchase something like a 555 setup already or does it need to be made? I just dont have the time right now, ive got a mile long list of other things to catch up on.
     
  15. inwo

    Well-Known Member

    Nov 7, 2013
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  16. AUTO

    Thread Starter New Member

    May 11, 2013
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    Sure does look like it, and those are cheap enough to carry a few replacements! Wow they come from hong kong, must take a month to get here!

    Ill let ya know about the ebay one. Dont feel responsible, i clicked the buy button after all lol
     
  17. inwo

    Well-Known Member

    Nov 7, 2013
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    Check back in a couple weeks. I'll let you know how they work.
     
  18. AUTO

    Thread Starter New Member

    May 11, 2013
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    Ok so i wries up the impulse relay and it works great and does exactly what i want, bu theres a problem.

    There is a speaker and subwoofer hooked to the same 12v power source and ground as my impulse relay. When i press the momentary button there is no noise, but when i release the momentary button the subwoofer makes a Thump noise.

    I tried placing diodes on both the power and ground side but did not solve the problem. Is it releasing voltage through the ground when the solenoid releases?
     
  19. inwo

    Well-Known Member

    Nov 7, 2013
    2,433
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    Do you mean a diode across the impulse relay coil?

    That is where it should be. To shunt the energy stored in the coil.
     
  20. AUTO

    Thread Starter New Member

    May 11, 2013
    9
    0
    No i didnt place it across. Ive been doing some reading this evening and it looks like that should be the solution! Ill try it tomorrow and post back.

    Thanks
     
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