Mantrap system

Discussion in 'The Projects Forum' started by Dark timmy, Feb 21, 2010.

  1. Dark timmy

    Thread Starter New Member

    Feb 18, 2010
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    0
    :DHi guys thanx for the great site!!:D

    I need some help on a project i want to build but don't really have the knowledge to do it. Its basically a 4 door automated system. Let me explain...

    You have 2 doors in and 2 doors out. First door at entrance side is open until you get inside then it closes behind you and 2nd door opens, Same on exit side,
    workes with maglocks.

    It needs to have a control panel with a rotary switch that can turn for example...

    Bank open. Door 1 open and door 2 closed same on exit side door 1 open door 2 closed.

    Bank closed. Door 1and 2 closed. It has a extra button for door 1 which is staff entry, the exit side has to be normal open.

    Bank locked. All 4 doors are locked but has a button on panel for last exit and key switch on outside for entrance again.

    Override. All 4 doors are opened.

    It must be a 12v system. Im sorted on the psu side so only need some suggestions on how to build the control unit for the door.

    The system we are using at the moment has a mplc and IR beams but gives alot of problems so i want to build something basic and cheap to replace it. If anyone have circuit or diagram i might be able to use please let me know.

    If you need any info or pictures on how it should operate let me know.

    Thanx a lot

    D.T :eek:
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2010
  2. Dark timmy

    Thread Starter New Member

    Feb 18, 2010
    7
    0
    Atlast, got the right word for it. Its a 4 door interlocking system
     
  3. KMoffett

    AAC Fanatic!

    Dec 19, 2007
    2,574
    230
    Before you try to reinvent/redesign the wheel, what are the problems and the apparent causes in the current system?

    Ken
     
  4. Dark timmy

    Thread Starter New Member

    Feb 18, 2010
    7
    0
    Hi Ken

    Thanks for looking at my post, first the problem is with the switching of the maglocks, the contacts on the relay shorts out then it stands open. The person building the system says it a moglock problem but if replaced it three or four times and still the same problem.
    Secondly the MPLC which is made by Ge Fanuc works with 9v relays which i can't find anywhere is South Africa, usually i replace them form old units then trigger another relay through the 9v one, seem to sort the problem but im all out of 9v relays so its a big probem cause its bank security doors. And third its a very expensive system (R19,000.00)($2,152.24) wi\thout installation or anything else. I think it might be cheaper to build another one with the same functions but much easier to service.

    Thanx
    D.T :eek:
     
  5. williamj

    Active Member

    Sep 3, 2009
    180
    32
    DT,

    Assuming you do have to build from scratch, a programmable logic controller (PLC) may be the way to go. By using a PLC you really don't have to "build" anything. PLCs can be purchased from most industrial supply houses (here in the states) and are fairly reasonable in price. Depending on number of inputs and outputs a small PLC can be had for under five hundred dollars (US). With a PLC (and probably some new relays) you could utilize the existing sensors and operators.

    just my two cents,

    williamj
     
    Dark timmy likes this.
  6. KMoffett

    AAC Fanatic!

    Dec 19, 2007
    2,574
    230
    Do you mean that the contacts weld together? Do you have schematics/diagrams for the current system?

    Ken
     
  7. Dark timmy

    Thread Starter New Member

    Feb 18, 2010
    7
    0
    Hi

    Thanks williamj will try and take a look at it, only one problem how user friendly is the programming on the plc's?

    D.T :eek:
     
  8. Dark timmy

    Thread Starter New Member

    Feb 18, 2010
    7
    0
    Hi Ken

    Yes thats exactly what i meant. They "weld" together then the system stands in one of the steps. Green and red light is on at the outside door and door 2 maglock is stuck, only way to get it to release is to do a evacuation.

    Wish i could supply u with a diagram but the nearest i can get to that is a photo of the system itself. If it will help let me know exactly what u want then i'll get it

    Thanx again

    D.T:eek:
     
  9. KMoffett

    AAC Fanatic!

    Dec 19, 2007
    2,574
    230
    I think this will be like diagnosing an engine problem by looking at a picture of the car. :( As far as the contacts welding together, it sounds like the relay contacts are either way underrated for the amount of current the maglock is drawing, or there is a short that occurs in the maglock circuit. It appears that I'm not going to be much help.

    Ken
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2010
  10. Dark timmy

    Thread Starter New Member

    Feb 18, 2010
    7
    0
    Hi Ken

    Great one! LOL
    The 9v relays are 3a and the maglock is suppose to draw between 3 - 4 mA but form what i can find it must be a spike from when the power returns to the maglock to get it energised again, any help on how to prevent that perhaps?
    Other weird thing is i've got about 20 installed but its only a certain few that give problems

    I've got a link for u if u can take a look, the ones we are using are similair to the 12V-140-SBEL one. Can that be the problem?
    http://www.boomgatesystems.co.za/files/SPECS & PHOTOS.pdf

    Thanx so far Ken!!
    D.T:eek:
     
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2010
  11. KMoffett

    AAC Fanatic!

    Dec 19, 2007
    2,574
    230
    Are you sure your maglocks draw only 3-4mA? The ones you referenced are in the 0.3-0.4A range. Do you have a link for the relays...or a manufacturer/model?

    Since some work OK and some don't, has this been the case since installation (when)? Have you contacted the company that made and/or installed the system?

    Ken
     
  12. Dark timmy

    Thread Starter New Member

    Feb 18, 2010
    7
    0
    Hi Ken

    Just found your post now. The 2-4 mA is what the guy from the mantrap company told me.

    The problem usually starts 3-4 months after installation. We buy the systems and I install them. The guy from the company who builds the stuff isn't very usefull. The maglocks doesn't trigger directly from the Mplc but through a pc board if that help? The maglocks i've fitted to some of the other sites had no problems after that.

    Its the manual for the Mplc, we are using the GE Fanuc Versa max Micro controller, ive seen the specs on it but its all weird to me, maybe its got all the info you need.

    I'll check for the relay specs tomorrow, but it should be in the datasheet.

    www.geindustrial.com/products/specs/micronano.pdf



    Thanx Ken

    D.T:eek:
     
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2010
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