As many of you know I am a touring musician and I and my band mates own several complete large sound systems. Now on stage we have our own personal amps and speakers such as each guitarist will run 6-200 watt Marshall Heads...amps...each one powering 2 4x12 inch Celestron Speakers...thus each head powers 8 12 inch speakers in 2 cabs.

The bass player uses...depending upon venue...and same with the guitarists...6 Gallien Krueger Bass amps putting out 1000 watts each...only available if placed by custom order as retail sale versions are 500 watt...along with 4 AB !200 watt amps with all powering a wide variety of 18 inch, 15 inch, 12 inch...and a few JBL horns used to reproduce the cluck or finger picking style of play.

Along with this is a Floor Moniter system of Duel JBL 15's and JBL Horns in each Floor cab and there are 8 of these along with Side Fill Moniters...2-18's...4-15's...4-12's and JBL Horns...on each side of the stage powered by AB Pro Series 2012 Amps...custom ordered.

Now all of this is just stage personal equipment and has nothing to do with the Hung P.A. of which we have 2 full systems that can be made into many configurations. EVERYTHING...is IDIOT PROOFED as cable connections are all color coded...sized and snaked as depending upon what configuration we use...there is a seperate snaked cable system for both sides flying and specialized junction boxes as well EVERYTHING is Computer Controlled as far as Analization done first to get the needed settings for EQ, Effects, Compressor Limitors and now even the Electronic Crossovers are Computerized.

All this said...at 400 Cycles to 0 are frequencies the Human Ear cannot hear...and between 0 and say 800 cycles...a person FEELS the sound more than hears it as such a system is pushing a large amount of Air Mass. What we have found is that if we boost low end at 200, 400 and 550...then add a boost point at 850...but adjust crossover output so that 850 cycle frequency is boosted in the 15 inch speakers and that 200 and 400 boosts are coming from just 18's....there seems to be a frequency overlap or perhaps a specific way the air mass is being pushed and thus transfering kinetic energy.

When this happens...People start getting SICK! And I mean...Puking, upset stomach, bowel movements...the works. I have been told by some people learned in Sound that this is highly unlikely but for us in the business who work with such massive equipment....WE KNOW IT TO BE A REALITY.

Split Infinity

 

South Park: The Brown Noise
at 18:33
http://www.blinkx.com/watch-video/s...oncert-the-brown-noise/f5Yh-0PgdFNxziXWdJfn-g

 

South Park: The Brown Noise
at 18:33
http://www.blinkx.com/watch-video/s...oncert-the-brown-noise/f5Yh-0PgdFNxziXWdJfn-g

LOL!

I never saw that one pretty good!

I will tell you...this low frequency thing works! We had heard about it and anyone who has ever stood in front of a bunch of 18 inch speakers will feel the sound punch in their gut...but if you set up a system and boost at the frequencies I posted...people really start feeling ill.

Split Infinity

 

Split,

I never would have thought this was a real effect. I did see the South Park episode and figured it was just South Park comedy. So how many times have you witnessed this sort of thing?

This would be a great crowd control during riots.

Pladuim

 

Busted:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mQFL-NLh0O8

 

Split,

A little off topic here, but when I used to build towers we had this fellow that went up a broadcast tower to change some blown lights. He came down off the tower before the job was complete because he felt terribly sick. 3 days later he was dead due to being hit with too much RF. Turned out the tech. thought he could get away with not turning the signal down because it was race day and didn't want race fans to miss the event.

Pladuim

 

Split,

Would you ever use the Mythbusters as a credible source to prove or disprove something?

Pladuim

 

Split,

Dug this up from a reliable source. Notice they mention low frequency. I will also add that they haven't found the "brown sound" either.

http://m.popsci.com/technology/article/2012-11/acoustic-weapons-book-excerpt

Pladuim

 

Split,

After digging around on the net I found that this may be very possible. It seems though that it doesn't work on everyone. Next time you have a concert, give it a go but make sure you film it so we all can watch it on youtube.

Pladuim

 

I'll be back on Monday, take care.

Pladuim

 

All this said...at 400 Cycles to 0 are frequencies the Human Ear cannot hear...and between 0 and say 800 cycles...a person FEELS the sound more than hears it as such a system is pushing a large amount of Air Mass.

Huh?

Humans can't hear frequencies below 400Hz?

I would think that a musician would be aware that half of the keys on an 88-key piano are below 400Hz and that nearly 3/4 are below 800Hz. The lowest key on the piano is 27.5Hz. Middle C is about 261Hz.

 

Such experiments have been done in the UK in the 1950s and 1960s.

Digging out decades old stuff.

I don't think with 1kW you'd get anywhere. You'd need 50kW or so.

 

Huh?

Humans can't hear frequencies below 400Hz?

I would think that a musician would be aware that half of the keys on an 88-key piano are below 400Hz and that nearly 3/4 are below 800Hz. The lowest key on the piano is 27.5Hz. Middle C is about 261Hz.

Musicians DO know that. So do any electronics guys who might work on audio equipment or speaker systems.

Splitinfinity has little to no music or electronic experience. Weird huh.

 

You really stepped into it this time Split. Anyone who has taken Biology/General Science in High School knows that the range of hearing for humans is 20 - 20,000 Hz, although a good deal of individuals will not be able to hear the entire spectrum.

...and you claim to be a musician?

As to sound being used as a weapon, check into Vladimir Gavreau. Further, for all you conspiracy followers, US Patent 6, 017, 302 is for a sound weapon to inflict a reaction for crowd control. And for those that are idolize Tesla, check into a reported situation that involved Mark Twain. Don't know the validity but it is out there none the less.

Oh my Split, you came to a gunfight with a knife.

Mikado

 

I am not a musician but I know 440 Hz is a pure A note, well above above human speech. It is a standard for music tuners and musical instruments. The EU uses 442 or 443Hz.

Telephones use a frequency range of 300Hz to 3.4Khz to maximize analog bandwidth. Humans typically hear between 80Hz to 14Khz, though teens and younger people have a much wider range (before they take out their hearing with loud music).

 

Are you for real, SI???

Hearing range is 20Hz to 20KHz.

And seriously? Making people SICK with low frequencies???

 

And for those that are idolize Tesla, check into a reported situation that involved Mark Twain. Don't know the validity but it is out there none the less.

Oh my Split, you came to a gunfight with a knife.

Mikado

That was a vibrating platform, not the sound waves generated by speakers. In order to get a similar vibration would require VERY powerful speakers. Ridiculously-powerful speakers. It's not going to happen.

 

That was a vibrating platform, not the sound waves generated by speakers. In order to get a similar vibration would require VERY powerful speakers. Ridiculously-powerful speakers. It's not going to happen.

What does it matter the medium that the frequencies propagate to the body?
Did you check the other person I mentioned? Did you check the patent?

Never say never.

Mikado

 

What does it matter the medium that the frequencies propagate to the body?
Did you check the other person I mentioned? Did you check the patent?

Never say never.

Mikado

I made it very clear why it matters what medium is used. It would require extremely powerful speakers to equal the vibrating platform Tesla built. NEVER argue with me about Tesla--you'll lose every time

As for Vladimir Gavreau and the patent, it requires sub-sonic vibrations at 150-155dB, which is about as loud as standing next to a running jet engine. You're not going to get anywhere near that with regular speakers. The loudest known rock concert only made it to about 120 decibels (The Who, 1970s). That was with massive speakers and amplifiers. You're not going to get anywhere near 150dB. You're going to need specialized equipment to create such effects as are described in the patent. Also, if you continue reading about the project here: http://cdn.preterhuman.net/texts/wars_and_weapons/military/Sargeant, Jack - Sonic Doom.pdf

It is possible to produce extremely strong infrasound and ultrasound at volumes high enough to cause damage, but, Altmann argued, producing the sounds alone is not enough to create an actual sonic weapon. The main difficulty lies in propagating the sound waves over distance to their intended target, a possibility hampered by the tendency of low-frequency waves to expand in all directions, thus losing focused power, and of high-frequency waves to enter a “shocked state” where energy is lost to the air. So sonic weapons, even those employing ultrasound and infrasound, would only work over very short distances and, rather than resulting in the kinds of psychological or physical effects claimed by conspiracy-heads or military nuts, would probably just cause serious and permanent hearing damage. Altmann had found no evidence that human targets would be rendered incapable of action by being severely spooked or losing physical control: “I have found no hard evidence for vomiting or uncontrolled defecation, even at levels of 170 dB or more.”

So, in short, the idea of weaponized sound is ridiculous. Even with crazy, groundbreaking technology, it would be horribly inefficient. So just stop. You're getting nowhere.

 

You really stepped into it this time Split. Anyone who has taken Biology/General Science in High School knows that the range of hearing for humans is 20 - 20,000 Hz, although a good deal of individuals will not be able to hear the entire spectrum.

...and you claim to be a musician?

As to sound being used as a weapon, check into Vladimir Gavreau. Further, for all you conspiracy followers, US Patent 6, 017, 302 is for a sound weapon to inflict a reaction for crowd control. And for those that are idolize Tesla, check into a reported situation that involved Mark Twain. Don't know the validity but it is out there none the less.

Oh my Split, you came to a gunfight with a knife.

Mikado

There you go...getting all excited that you caught me making a mistake and jumping to conclusions.

Let me explain...years ago we used to use 1/3 Octave 31 Band Graphic EQ's...now day's we use Computer Software to do EQ'ing but although you and a few have jumped on me for my Human Hearing statement as far as where the cut off is or low low a frequency can Human Ears hear at...THAT is different than at what EQ cut off setting is necessary to prevent unwanted power usage being sent to reproduce unwanted or unneeded frequences that when being reproduced by specific Speakers and Cabinet Design that have been emgineered for LONG THROW or some for WIDE THROW...and because of these designs...certain Frequencies of Sound cannot be heard by Human Ears due to the way the purposeful design of speakers and cabinets will not allow them to be.

As example...JBL 2445 and Custom A-5428 DRIVERS and horns are LONG THROW DESIGN...now we use Computerized EQ's that have many more BOOST points than just the 31 Boost Points available on a 1/3 Octave EQ....but for the LAYMEN HERE...I will explain it using a 31 Band Graph.

Using a 5 Way Electronic Crossover...the 4th crossover point would be at 2500 Cycles thus anything above 2500 would be sent to the sound processing Pre-Amp before sent directly to amplification which may or maynot be run in Phase.

Now because of the JBL Horn Construction and design...as the Horn is simply either a Metal or Wooden HORN LIKE attachment onto the JBL DRIVER as the driver is powered to create sound in whatever frequency range we sent to it...and then without the Horn designed in our case to send sound at distance and at Wide Send...a person would not be able to hear specific frequencies even if they had their ear right to it.

In the case of the SRX-Custom Pro Series 18 Speakers...as well as the new Custom JBL Low Frequency Long/Wide Kicker Moduals...which bands started using about 7 years ago...EQ settings and cut off points at 400 cycles as such speakers very expensive cabinet design are recommended not to recieve signal at any lower than 400 cycles into them if the band is using the Modular Kickers.
The reason for this is that the created Air Mass Movement generated by both the modual and the Speaker/Cabinet will produce cleaner and non-distorted below 400 cycle frequency from a low end signal between 400 and 800 cycles. Thus a drummers bass drum trigger or mic will pick up signal at a frequency below 400 cycles yet boost signal at 400 to 600 cycles being reproduced through modern speaker and cabinet design as well as Kicker Moduals and then by design sent both Long Throw and in the case of the Kickers...omni-directional and by such air mass throw encountering objects of mass...walls, ceilings, human bodies...etc...such interaction will generate a Lower Frequency Rumble at better clarity and less distortion than in say a 200 cycle signal was being reproduced and thrown plus the Modular Kickers are both creating and generating Low Rumble movements that in turn generate generated PUNCH.
YES...I understand that Human Hearing can hear frequencies below 400 cycles...and the way I wrote about it I can see how it would look like I made a mistake...but what I was doing was explaining how we set our EQ's and Crossover Points as to have an EQ boost point in the rage between 0 and 400 cycles to any great extent IS A WASTE in that due to the design of equipment, speaker and cabinet throw capabilities...Low Frequency Generation of sound created within a venue do to Kinetic Transfer thus vibration of all and any objects within the venue or the structure itself...and to be quite honest...this level of KNOWLEDGE having to due with SOUND REPRODUCTION specific to a venue and geometry is simply above anyone on this board with the exception of ME.

Yes...I should have been more clear and yes I was wrong in that I typed one thing but ment another....STILL...if a person here is a bass player or is in a small band...and say they have a simple 1/3 Octave 31 Band Graph instead of the Computer Software...they would probably just slide the first 3 EQ slides on the LEFT all the way to the bottom as to cut off the very lowest frequencies....BUT....if you are using Massive Systems with Modulated Kickers that require very specific frequency settings and crossover points...this is all going to sound like Greek to the layman.

The way to make a person SICK...is not specific to the actions of boosting ultra-low frequencies...say from 0 to 100 cycles...but rather boosting the frequencies and overlap them as I have descibed above.

If just using 0 to 100 cycles was all that was needed then ever person that had a Kicker in the car properly amplified would be getting sick.

Split Infinity