That is what I did with the one I thought would work. I figured out I was having a brain fart with shrinking it, the distances were off, but it still comes out very very ugly.

Much better to start from the PCB drawing in PCB Express and start from scratch. It will come out perfect then.

I've been looking for a better free graphics program with reasonable resolution for decades with no luck. If I had a graphics program like Adobe Acrobat it might do it, but they tend to be extra pricey.

 

I use inkscape and GIMP.

Both free, and INKSCAPE is vector, so you can have as high a resolution as you want.

Gimp also allows multiple thousand DPI, and is feature for feature compatible with Adobe PhotoShop...but it is free.

 

Gimp did it. I don't have much of a clue how to use it, but it looks like my focus of study will be changing. Using Express PCB I saved an PDF file, loaded it into Gimp, saved the file as a .png, shut down gimp, and reloaded everything, then cropped and mirrored the file. The dimensions were accurate, it was completely B&W (no fuzziness), there was no gray scale. Looks like from my point of view this is a solved issue. The OP may have other ideas, we'll wait to hear from him. I did send a PM pointing the question I asked several screens ago, namely how is he wanting to have this board made.

If he wants to use the company Express PCB I need to eliminate the jumpers and turn them into the top layer of the board. If he wants to use toner transfer that is a different can of worms. I'm pretty confident I could do a good job of it from here, though I really don't like some of the pads PCB Express uses (namely the DIP pads).

 

Hello Bill,

What graphic program did you use?
Did you have a look at the giant the GIMP?
http://www.gimp.org/
Or have a look at XnView, a graphics format converter?
http://www.xnview.com/en/xnview.html
Or to create the PDF's take a look at DORO PDF, wich acts as a printerdriver?
http://run.to/sz

Bertus

 

I'm not looking forward to learning Gimp. Everything is buried, there is nothing obvious about it from what I saw. It is meant for web imaging, I need paper imaging. It does the job well however, I just have to get over it.

That floating toolbar is especially obnoxious, but it you close it the program closes to.

 

Thanks everyone,
I am sorry if I caused any problems with my thread and yes I do plan on doing the board myself. I have no where near the knowlege in electronics of any one of you folks but I am very impressed with all of yours. As I have always posted a (newbie) and a lot of times I feel like a box of rocks when reading your posts but I always work it out with your help. This is the most helpful site I have ever been on and for me a guy who never use either of the Express programs to re due Ron and Bill M's schematic to the satisfaction of Bill M I was pretty darn proud. I deeply apppreciate all of your effort! I'm very happy I joined this site. Thanks All JIM
PS. My reason for redraw was to teach myself all the paths to pins and it helped greatly for me to understand as I did mention there were alot of parts I was unfamiliar with!

 

...
Just for the halibut I may try making this board (etching that is) using the Paint compatible templates.
...

Bill, if you do so, I would like to see some pictures. Please.

 

Bill, the problem isn't the actual software you've been using, but the fact that all the software you've been using has been PIXEL Based.

InkScape is Vector based, so moving lines, etc allows the traces to keep the same width and overall size.

InkScape will import bitmaps and covert them to vector based images (such as SVG, some of PDF files, and CAD Drawings). Then working with them you will NEVER have the problem of "fuzzies" if you turn off anti-aliasing when you decide to make your final design to print. The grey will show up while working on it so all the edges look nice for printouts and display, but as you know, the grey "fuzz" from anti-aliasing is the bane of PC Boards.

InkScape and GIMP go hand in hand, but the interface to inkscape is more intuitive if you understand vector graphics instead of pixel graphics. Vector graphics only describe the lines and dimensions, whereas pixel based programs don't care about lines and spacing, since they were made for working with photos, not vectors.

PC Boards are vectors. Line width, length, circle center, diameter, etc, are "vector" numbers. Add in angles and junction points (included in all modern vector based software), and you have what is essentially a perfect software solution to making PC Boards!

 

Raster is to Vector

as

Inkscape is to GIMP

as

Adobe Illustrator is to Adobe PhotoShop

 

The resultant .png file is perfect. If I upload it the site will translate it to a .gif file, which may be what happened to Wookie's version. Gimp goes to a much higher DPI, which solves all the problems. I'm not arguing vector works, but the core problem is the minimum resolution of the software. In this case the picture is 600 DPI, same as the printer. Printers are fundamentally a pixel system, always.

 

Bill, if you do so, I would like to see some pictures. Please.

Are you talking about the finished PCB pictures?

 

Yes, please. If you make it. Copper side and component side.

 

Bill,
BG did it again I ordered the LM393 (8 pin) they shipped me LM389 (18 pin) lol. I called and they are reshipping the LM 393 . I do hope you post your complete pix when you are done. PS. If you do a Test PCB with your new found programs I can't see you trowing it out and you have my snail mail. LOL just kidding Jim

 

I don't have a problem with that. This has been an interesting exercise from my point of view. I'll get back with you.

 

The resultant .png file is perfect. If I upload it the site will translate it to a .gif file, which may be what happened to Wookie's version. Gimp goes to a much higher DPI, which solves all the problems. I'm not arguing vector works, but the core problem is the minimum resolution of the software. In this case the picture is 600 DPI, same as the printer. Printers are fundamentally a pixel system, always.

The biggest difference is that while working with the image, it isn't dots, so DPI doesn't matter, DPI is infinite in a vector program. It is only rasterized (turned into pixels) when printing. The important part is that when printing, it is scaled to the correct DPI to match your printer. Lines can be defined as 0.01" wide, or points 0.1" apart. Then when printed, the lines will be of the width specified, with no fuzzy edges, and no scaling to worry about.

It's the logical halfway point between GIMP/Paint/Photoshop and a CAD Program. It can "trace" bitmaps to vectors of all your current library of components as well. Then you copy and paste the components as a "group" of vectors, rather than a bunch of pixels with some pixels dark, the others white.


It could be used for your breadboard models as well, but schematics and PC Boards or any other "line art" type items are where the vector based programs really shine. Fonts are vector based, which is what allows them to be infinitely scaled.

 

I understand all that. But all of my problem, all of them, were a simple matter of resolution, vector graphics isn't even a part of it. While the Express program uses vector graphics, the .png standard is not vector graphics system. With Gimp it boosts the .png standard to 600 DPI. Printers are also pixel systems, not vector. I am not misunderstanding you, but the devices and standards I'm dealing with are all pixel based, as were the problems I was fighting. When you print a vector image it has to be translated to a pixel system for the printer.

Anyhow, I polished the PCB.png file. At the moment, until I learn Gimp better, I switched between Paint and Gimp. This is the final result (I hope). I really didn't like the pads as drawn, so I reworked them. I also cleaned up a few traces where I thought they were too close or squared.

 

I've started a tutorial...

How I make PCBs

 

Bill,
I noticed the pins are curved on those in pix from RS the ones I picked up are not does that make a diff?Here is a pic of mine!

 

The sockets are usable, and the curve doesn't make any difference. I am including a batch of machine pin sockets (you will see the difference) in the package. I was just packing it when I got your PM. I have 100% of the stuff you need, is there anything else you are having trouble getting, such as capacitors, resistors, or transistors?

I'll repeat my warning about U4 polarity. This is because it is the kind of mistake I would be most likely to make. I put the caps next to pin 1 to help remind you, but even if the socket is in straight (or backwards) the chip could go in either way.

 

Bill,
Thanks again I think I'm OK .Is the original shopping list you posted is still the same? If so I think I'm ok. The only questionable parts was the IRF510 from RS and yes I did make note on the flipped IC. I did pick up the 510's from RS. Jim
PS. In my 1st. project we worked on the timers I still am haveing some problems with the one that is the longest approx. 1.5 hr. Is it possible the I had ESD with the 555 I installed in that board? Should I change all 8 of the 555's and make sure I'm ESD protected? When it is running and I flip another timer on it goes off. Thanks Jim