Large Hadron Collider

Discussion in 'Physics' started by Dave, Sep 10, 2008.

  1. Dave

    Thread Starter Retired Moderator

    Nov 17, 2003
    6,960
    144
    I'm surprised this hasn't been mentioned today.

    This morning (09.30 GMT) the Large Hadron Collider (LHC) performed its first run of protons in a series of experiments that hope to unlock the answers to some of the fundamental questions of physics including the mystery of the Higgs Boson, and an attempt to create the conditions fractions of a second after the Big Bang. 13 years and billions of pounds latter it finally ran for the first time. We also have a plethora of worried about the knock-on effect of LHC experiments (end of the world, etc) including a court case in the European courts to prevent any experiments taking place.

    Its been the top news story over here today, anyone else been following this?

    Dave
     
  2. mik3

    Senior Member

    Feb 4, 2008
    4,846
    63
    I heard it at the news yesterday its an intersting thing. Can you explain whats do you mean by the knock-on effect.
     
  3. beenthere

    Retired Moderator

    Apr 20, 2004
    15,815
    282
    Lessee here - if the Higgs particle (liked it better when it was the intermediate vector boson) doesn't turn up, then some (most?) of modern cosmology goes back to the drawing board.

    I should suppose they really do hope that those incidental micro black holes evaporate quickly - they could be hard on the equipment.
     
  4. Voltboy

    Active Member

    Jan 10, 2007
    197
    0
    Oh... so thats the why of the picture in Google´s name :)
    I have no clue what is a Higgs boson.. but I hope they find out stuff about the big bang.
    Check out the How Stuff Works article about the LHC.
     
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2008
  5. Wendy

    Moderator

    Mar 24, 2008
    20,765
    2,536
    Anyone want to read a relatively old Sci-Fi book on just such a scenario, try "Thrice Upon a Time" by James Hogan. A good read that I recommend.
     
  6. Dave

    Thread Starter Retired Moderator

    Nov 17, 2003
    6,960
    144
    There are lots of crazy ideas flying around about the safety of the LHC: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safety_of_the_Large_Hadron_Collider

    Most notably there is the creation of micro-black-holes which aim to give the insight into the moments seconds after the big bang - obvious the mention of black-holes gives the impression of impending doom as it absorbs everything and anything around it.

    Dave
     
  7. Wendy

    Moderator

    Mar 24, 2008
    20,765
    2,536
    I can't help noticing we're still here. Of course, any black holes generated by this process would be in the quark size, assuming they were stable. It would take the life of the universe for them to double their mass, or some such. Current theory says they evaporate almost as soon as their made.
     
  8. Voltboy

    Active Member

    Jan 10, 2007
    197
    0
    Does the mass that the BH sucks is taken account to determining the new Schwarzschild radius?
     
  9. loosewire

    AAC Fanatic!

    Apr 25, 2008
    1,584
    435
    Low velocity test only the other day,no quick answer's.They say
    any result's will be studied for decades (like 20 year's) they will have
    many image's to study. Now a day's the picture's are computer
    generated.
     
  10. triggernum5

    Active Member

    May 4, 2008
    216
    0
    The mass that a black hole takes in is really only directly related to what is available in the vicinity, but its Swarzchild radius will be dependant on how much mass it has managed to gather.. I think thats a confirmation of what you asked VoltBoy..
     
  11. Voltboy

    Active Member

    Jan 10, 2007
    197
    0
    A transformer in the point 8 of the LHC had a problem. The first collision (Thursday) got posponed.
     
  12. Wendy

    Moderator

    Mar 24, 2008
    20,765
    2,536
    True enough, but the mass in this case is a few atoms at high energy levels. Not much to work with, the energy levels probably contribute more mass than the atoms.
     
  13. nanovate

    Distinguished Member

    May 7, 2007
    665
    1
  14. triggernum5

    Active Member

    May 4, 2008
    216
    0
    No sympathy here.. Thats just retarded.. I mean why waste perfectly good poison if the LHC is going to kill everyone anyways? Well, I guess the concept of conservation can go out the window if the world is going to end, but still..
    Actually, is there anything in Hinduism that makes it bad to be around at the end of the world? I guess its pretty much irrelevant since they believe in reincarnation anyways..
    If the 'reasoning' isn't religeously based though, thats kind of like shooting yourself in the head because your parachute didn't open..
     
  15. Dave

    Thread Starter Retired Moderator

    Nov 17, 2003
    6,960
    144
    The first major experiment (the ones that are potentially the dangerous ones) is scheduled for 21st October.

    It is worth noting that the safety consultation was many years and concluded the experiments posed negligible-to-no risk.

    Dave
     
  16. Dave

    Thread Starter Retired Moderator

    Nov 17, 2003
    6,960
    144
  17. CVMichael

    Senior Member

    Aug 3, 2007
    416
    17
  18. triggernum5

    Active Member

    May 4, 2008
    216
    0
    I tried to open the link, but I was redirected to a homeland security page informing me I shouldn't bother trying to get on any planes..:) <JK>, the link worked for me, and that may just be the coolest hacking venture ever..
     
  19. Dave

    Thread Starter Retired Moderator

    Nov 17, 2003
    6,960
    144
    Thanks for the other source. I'm not sure how the BBC website is viewed outside of the UK - after all we pay a license fee towards the BBC so there are restrictions to viewers from non-UK IP addresses.

    I wouldn't say "coolest"! :)p) It is one thing hacking a (government) system which may disclose information; it is a whole other thing hacking a system that is managing something as sophisticated and potentially hazardous as the LHC, if only to those who are immediately working on it.

    That said, one has to be concerned that such a system can be penetrated with what appears like relative ease. This isn't going to help ahead of the big test-runs that are upcoming.

    Dave
     
  20. triggernum5

    Active Member

    May 4, 2008
    216
    0
    As far as I know though they were purist hackers.. Purist hackers merely break into things to say they did.. They don't destroy or profit, its about the challenge.. Granted
    they'll have to scour the system to ensure nothing malicious went down, but on the plus side, whether they find trouble or not, atleast they're now aware of a security hole that could be abused worse in the future..
     
Loading...