Interesting poll from The Engineer ... UK

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by JoeJester, Oct 18, 2016.

  1. JoeJester

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  2. dannyf

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    Let me point one gross equality that I think needs to be corrected: motherhood has been exclusive reserved for women. Men have been unfairly discriminated here.

    As such I propose that we shall randomly select 1 out of every 2 women and revoke her rights to mother ship forever and award to that a randomly selected man.

    Similarly 1 out of every two lucky women shall be required to father a child.

    A non partisan computer will be used to carry out such justice.

    Then everyone will be happy. :)
     
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  3. tcmtech

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    My Ex thought at marrying an American who believed in equal rights for women would be a good thing. :eek:

    Turned out it really sucks being married to someone who treats you as an equal right down to insisting you do your own crap work because he has to do his himself. :oops:

    I true equal rights treatment you don't get to pick and chose what you do or do not want. :(
     
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  4. #12

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    When I was in a cast from my waist to the ground, a woman asked me what I was doing so she wouldn't have to work when she's 40. I could have said, I'm growing a new leg while finishing my college degree, but I said, "Women are equal. What are you doing so I won't have to work when I'm 40?"

    That was the end of that woman.:p
     
  5. tcmtech

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    Been the story of my life. What am I doing to make someone else's life better for them at my expense?

    Not a damn thing. I have enough trouble keeping my life floating at a level I find tolerable. :oops:
     
  6. SLK001

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    In my career, I did a lot of candidate interviewing. A lot of women were interviewed, but surprisingly, very few were actually qualified for the job they were interviewing for. A lot of them tried to get by on their looks and sexuality, as evidenced by their college transcripts and knowledge, but we didn't need lookers or hookers, so they were passed over. I believe that I only hired three women as engineers. The first one had a 4.0 GPA in engineering from Georgia Tech and was an outstanding person and engineer. The second and third women were hired within a month of each other. However, they cheated. The first one interviewed and told the second, "One guy (referring to me) will give you the hardest interview of your life. Study this, this, this and this." When the second woman came in, she was very much prepared and knowledgeable on the subject that it was a breeze to hire her (she wasn't given answers, just areas to study). All three remain great friends of mine to this day.

    Another woman was the wife of another senior engineer and somehow, successfully made it through the interview process. She had about as much knowledge as a boat anchor. I was given the dubious pleasure of having her assigned to my design team. She could do nothing during the week, but somehow made progress on the weekends (when her hubby helped her with her work). She once had an RF layout to complete for the PCB draftsman. At the final meeting with the PCB team, I took one look at her work and stopped the design. I told the PCB team that I would redo the work and I would have it the next day. She was livid and so began a tale of sexual harassment complaints against me and my supervisor. Sexual harassment allegations were vigorously investigated by HR. The subsequent investigation found "no basis for the complaint" and she was told that she had to either transfer to another division in another town, or be terminated. At the time, HR did all their investigation in secret and interviewed our entire team, without either my or my super's knowledge. At that time, my team also had the woman engineer from GaTech, who was also interviewed. Her comments that neither me nor my super were ever antagonistic with her and that we were always glad to help her with problems and help guide her to finish her duties. She also said the she had never seen nor heard of any sexual harassment by us toward the complaintor.

    So, it's not us engineers who are keeping women out of the profession. It is their lack of effort in getting the proper training and credentials that is keeping them out. I frankly didn't care what the sex was of any member my team. If they could do the job, then they got the job. I only wanted the best that I could get, because frankly, it made my job easier.
     
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  7. #12

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    That reminds me...on one job, the best man there was a woman.
    One of the crew brought his sister to a job which was very physical. She was the only person there who worked harder and accomplished more than I did. I only regret that she decided not to join our crew in the long term.:(
     
  8. tcmtech

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    Yea working day in and day out with a bunch of lasy ass men can be a real downer. :oops:
     
  9. #12

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    Pssst...you're supposed to put a [/sarcasm off] after that.

    I worked with that crew for 37 years and the reason I remember that woman is that it was a real surprise that any first day employee could out-perform anybody on my regular crew. If she was willing, we would have hired her any time!
     
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  10. tcmtech

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    My first day/week ambitions tended to get me on the 'get rid of him before he takes your job' list of management. :(
     
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  11. dannyf

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    Those outcome driven initiatives tyoucskkybdont end up well for those such initiatives try to help. Witness the subprime housing crisis.

    Obviously we should encourage every kid to pursue his or her dream, be it engineering, acting or construction. To the extent that there exist barriers on the way to such dreams, we should help out.

    But preferential treatment to one group of people is necessarily discriminatory treatment of others, regardless of execution or intent.

    Such initiatives do nothing in fundamentally addressing the underline issues than to ferment anger and resentment towards the favored class and fracture our society, which in the end hurts the people who can least afford such shocks.
     
  12. GopherT

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    It's cool that Americans are so willing to supply strong opinions about how the UK culture should or shouldn't address their male/female engineering ratio.
     
  13. JoeJester

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    And that is never an issue in this country. The political will of the congress has already solved that problem. [/sarcasm]

    A critter from one of the plains states asked why there were no cadets at the coast guard academy from his state. The coastie said "None applied."

    The critter didn't like the answer, no matter how truthful it was.
     
  14. GopherT

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    Since there are many open topics, both serious and sarcastic, you'll have to clarify which problem you are referring to when you say, "That Problem".
     
  15. JoeJester

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    The engineering ratio.
     
  16. tindel

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    This is a topic that interests me... along with other somewhat tabot subjects.

    I once said to a buddy of mine... "I wish there were more girls in engineering." He told me I was sexist. I asked him why. He said, "Who cares what genitalia someone has as long as they are the best person for the job." Gave me a lot of perspective.

    My 6 yo daughter exhibits some engineering interest. I've debated whether I should encourage it or not or let her find it her own way. So that way if she does end up in engineering it is of her own ambition it instead of me pushing it. I do think engineering is a great discipline... well paid with reasonable work hours (if working for the right employer) and provides for a good lifestyle while also not spoiling a person, but able to be a single provider for a family.

    STEM is definately a great movement to encourage all kids to get into these fields - no matter what the sex. One of my favorite groups is FIRST robotics. Kids of both sexes get to try everything from project management to machining parts.

    We are talking about tens of thousands of years of evolution though. For at least the last 10k years men have brought home the food while women have prepared the food. It has just been recently (the last 50 years or so) that women have become more empowered to have good paying daily jobs. And this is really only in christian first world countries. You'd be hard pressed to find a woman in a prominent role in a impoverish or muslim country. I believe this stemmed from the culture change that occurred during WWI and WWII where women had to work in manufacturing plants to make war tools to support the troops for the allies to be successful. After the war our culture shifted, and many (most) families took on debt loads which required many women to continue working to pursue the 'American Dream'.

    What's funny about this is that I see the culture shifting. At least in my circle of friends. Engineers make enough money that they can support a family of 3-5 pretty easily so many of the engineers I know have wives that tend the home or work part-time while the husband works full-time. I think my generation is waking up to the fact that debt sucks the life out of a person as well. And most of those same friends live below their means.

    Generational socio-economic changes are so interesting to me.
     
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  17. GopherT

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    Evolution is easy to talk about but you have to remember that birth control pills didn't exist for the first 9950 of your 10k years. Not easy to go hunting with a child on your breast - Gathering tends to be the better activity.

    I think you should encourage your daughter to be brave and strong and that engineering is a fine job to think big and lead a company or a family.

    If, in the other hand you prefer to sit silently and let the views of your final two paragraphs pout like silent farts every so often, you can be sure your daughter will become a professional shopper and saddled with debt for the rest of her life. If your plan B is that she marries an engineer instead of becomes an engineer - good luck.
     
  18. tindel

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    Sep 16, 2012
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    If all you want to do is insult me and my family - please refrain from replying. :/ Thanks.

    The last two paragraphs were not intended to be pouting - just generational observations by myself.

    Birth control has nothing to do with this. It could have easily been the women that were the hunters and the men that were the caretakers - regardless of the number of children. Penguins do this and we could have easily as well - but that is not how most of the animal kingdom works.
     
  19. tindel

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    As far as my daughter goes. I will encourage her to do whatever she wants to do and remain debt free as she progresses through life. I obviously don't have any control over her debt load or not. I just hope to set the example.

    She's currently in a music class to encourage her in math, science, team work, self-esteem, and family building activities, along with knowing how to play piano and enjoy music. She is 6 and has no choice in the matter - she's going to that class thru completion of the curriculum (3 year program) because it teaches life-long skills. I will probably force her to be in FIRST lego league when she reaches middle school because it teaches real-world business and trade skills along with logical thinking. I won't force her to be in high school robotics. I will encourage her to do what she wants to do the last 4 years she is living in my home so she starts to learn what SHE wants to do.

    I guess my dilemma is if I'm pushing her too hard or not. I think the above plan is a good mixture of exposing her to things but then letting her decide where it goes from there.
     
  20. GopherT

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    Penguins are not mammals and, therefore, do not have mammary glands. Moms and dads are interchangeable once the egg is expelled in their case. Thanks for the comparison and the good laugh. My wife liked it too.
     
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