hello, plc training learning, courses and training equipement

Discussion in 'Programmer's Corner' started by ninjaman, Dec 28, 2014.

  1. ninjaman

    Thread Starter Member

    May 18, 2013
    306
    1
    hello

    im studying for HNC electronics at college and PLC is a unit. I like programming and would like to go into automation as a job.
    the course doesn't really provide any learning material, its down to me to learn programming. they provided a book that covers some stuff.
    I am also using scantime.co.uk training course that is provided online. I am waiting for the test for the first programming module. I have ordered programming modules 1, 2 & 3 and the two ALLEN BRADLEY modules. this is so I can get a certificate that says I have completed some specific course in PLC training. to impress (hopefully) my future employer and help me get a job. though I feel that the course may not be what I am expecting.
    I have seen videos on youtube and downloaded a few books. though there arnt any real practice exercises. I have a C programming book that is great for C programming compared to all the other books out there. it gives an explanation of something then some practice exercises that show what should happen. you have to match the end result.
    I cant find a book that teaches PLC like that. I can understand things like timers, counters and stuff. its not to difficult to pick that up but putting things together is the tricky bit.
    I have a project I have to complete, a training machine
    upload_2014-12-28_16-34-44.png
    I have to make this perform a task. the task is to move the flight bars (the white things in the tanks) from tank to tank for a period of time in each tank. the process is emulating (or simulating, whichever) a PCB etching process. pick up flight bar, move to tank 1, lower and leave for 5 seconds, lift and drip dry for 10 seconds, move on and so on. I have to have about three flight bars on the go at once. there is a solution that explains everything. but it seems that I have to understand the instructions before hand. so im reading about the instructions and trying to understand the process. I don't want to copy the printed solution as that wont help me.

    what I would like is to understand the process of designing a process, breaking it down and programming it. this would require flow charts I imagine though im not good at those. also, laying out a ladder diagram. the solution has about 10 ladder diagrams, not rungs but lad 2, lad 3 so on. im using RS logix 500.
    are there any books that go through designing the layout of a program? that says where you can use certain things.
    the solution to this problem uses a time diagram(?) not sure if that is the right name for it. it has the seconds for waiting. these seconds are put in the N7 data type on RS logix 500. these waiting times are MOVed around from timer to timer and compared using NEQ. its complex and would require some thought. im not sure of how to break it down. I have read a little about flow charts but cant seem to get it right. I can only use the motor output once so I have to use a lot of internal bits to do a lot of internal stuff. this stuff is what confuses me.
    any help would be great

    thanks
    hope you all had a nice Christmas/timeoff/holiday

    simon
     
  2. MaxHeadRoom

    Expert

    Jul 18, 2013
    10,570
    2,381
    It is like learning most things, small steps at a time, you sort of learn building blocks so as the projects gets a little more complicated you build on the last one.
    I assume you have the SLC500 reference manual?, there is some app examples at the end.
    I also have the Mitsubishi book by John Ridley that is also very good.
    You only use an output once usually as using it more than once is not something you would normally do in hardwired logic.
    That is the beauty of the PLC, you can not only reverse the logic of an input, you can use it as many times as you like.
    Max.
     
  3. ninjaman

    Thread Starter Member

    May 18, 2013
    306
    1
    hello

    I now have a micrologix 1000 and an fx1s-30mr-eu/ul. so one Mitsubishi and one allen Bradley. I have two books on the way, one for each. I have gx developer and that rs logix pro 500.
    I bought a cable from ebay for £10. its an sc09 usb-422. it has a box in the middle of the cable with two leds, one for tx and the other for rx. its a yellow cable which I think matters. I got a small cd with it though it has not been any help. I have tried downloading the drivers on the cd with no result. I have emailed the ebay seller with no reply. I have tried on mrplc with no answer.
    anyone know anything about these cables?
    I have windows 7, not xp. though the ebay ad specifies that it will work on windows 7.
    when I click on the cable driver in the properties box, it says that two drivers have been downloaded. serenum.sys and ch341s64.sys. also, usb serial ch340.
    i had a look at these on the internet and found that the last thing is to do with usb conversion.
    i have tried plugging this into the fx1s and transfer setup in gx developer. com7 and speed 9.6. though nothing happens. it says no connection.
    could this cable work with rs logix and micrologix?
    also, what am i doing wrong with the Mitsubishi plc?

    thanks
    simon
     
  4. MaxHeadRoom

    Expert

    Jul 18, 2013
    10,570
    2,381
    The AB and the Mitsubshi have two completely different interfaces, I bought the AB off ebay, the Mitsubishi I built my own, I have the schematic somewhere, but both these are 9 pin D RS232 port cables.
    I think there are instruction also out there on the web for making your own.
    Max.
     
  5. ninjaman

    Thread Starter Member

    May 18, 2013
    306
    1
    hello max

    no I already bought the cable, 422 to usb. I don't have an rs232 port.
    it seems that the correct driver has been installed from what I have seen on a youtube video.
    I cant get the plc to communicate with the pc though.
    could there be a fault in the plc?
    how could I test it?
    is there some way I could test the cable?

    thanks
    simon
     
  6. MaxHeadRoom

    Expert

    Jul 18, 2013
    10,570
    2,381
    It impossible to say from a distance, the positive way is to get someone local to confirm it.
    Max.
     
  7. ninjaman

    Thread Starter Member

    May 18, 2013
    306
    1
    this is the problem im having with my plc

     
  8. MaxHeadRoom

    Expert

    Jul 18, 2013
    10,570
    2,381
    I have the SC09 cable but it is the D RS232 version, and am using XP, I am guessing it is in the USB driver somewhere?
    Max.
     
  9. panic mode

    Senior Member

    Oct 10, 2011
    1,321
    304
    sorry if this seems like a silly few questions but:
    - where exactly did you get driver for your programming cable?
    - is the driver meant for Win7? did you try different one?
    - Is your PLC powered up?
    - Is cable connected to PLC?
    - what is the exact version of your GX developer?

    btw quick google search shows that many people have problem with CH340 drivers, for example
    http://doityourselfchristmas.com/forums/showthread.php?14690-CH340-USB-RS232-Driver
     
  10. ninjaman

    Thread Starter Member

    May 18, 2013
    306
    1
    hello

    sorry if I left this out. it is an 422 to usb not rs232. usb one end and 422 the other.
    I got the driver from a cd rom supplied and another from internet.
    I believe it is meant for windows 7. I have tried a few drivers.
    plc is powered up
    plc is connected to the pc
    gx dev is version 8
     
  11. panic mode

    Senior Member

    Oct 10, 2011
    1,321
    304
    no, I got that.
    I have the good old original SC09 for RS232 (Beijer) and it has built in RS232-RS422 converter (it is not "just cable", it gets power from PLC port):
    http://forums.mrplc.com/index.php?showtopic=4815

    but nowdays there are no more laptops with built in RS232 ports meaning that with current laptops I must also use usb to rs232 converter, then SC09.
    some Chinese made replacements are combining the two into one product (which is what you have). you still need driver for the chip doing USB to RS232 conversion.

    price of original SC09 drove many people to try to make replacements. some of those efforts are on mrplc.com but there are others like
    http://www.pinout.net/browse.php?catid=22&conid=664
    (I never tested them, never needed to...)

    at this stage I would say your only option is to try to identify source of problem:
    - PLC (could be bad though not likely)
    - cable
    - drivers

    it would be nice if you can find someone near you to try to connect using their and your cable.
    If that does not work for you, try getting another cable...
     
  12. MaxHeadRoom

    Expert

    Jul 18, 2013
    10,570
    2,381
    I made my own SC09 about 20yrs ago, But I retain a couple of older lap tops just for these older programs that use the RS232 port etc.
    There are many IBM Think Pads etc out there that can be had for a song that is useful for running these types of applications in the field, just write the program on the main PC and transfer to the laptop for debugging.
    Max.
     
  13. panic mode

    Senior Member

    Oct 10, 2011
    1,321
    304
    yep, I keep my old Dell M4300
     
  14. ninjaman

    Thread Starter Member

    May 18, 2013
    306
    1
    thing is I don't want to go through the hassle of buying another laptop, I have the cable and want to use it.
    I will try at college. they have plcs there.
    ill post the result
     
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