fish shocker plans needed

Discussion in 'The Projects Forum' started by TheEquineFencer, Nov 25, 2009.

  1. TheEquineFencer

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Apr 20, 2007
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    I'd like to build a electric fish shocker. I've checked and they ARE legal in my area, Eastern, NC, USA. Does anyone have plans or site that has plans? The rules are I cannot go over 300 Volts output going by the local fishing regulations.
     
  2. beenthere

    Retired Moderator

    Apr 20, 2004
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    They may be legal for you, but may not be for anybody else. I know they are not in Missouri or any of the surrounding states. Somebody giving plans could be held liable for allowing such things to be published.

    Perhaps if you could point out the explicit North Carolina Fish & Game regulation that permits a private fisherman to take fish with an electrofishing device.
     
  3. TheEquineFencer

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Apr 20, 2007
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    Special Fishing Devices
     Special fishing devices, which may be licensed for the taking of
    nongame fishes, include the following: bow and arrow (except
    crossbows), seines, cast nets, gill nets, dip nets, bow nets, reels,
    gigs, spear guns, baskets, fish pots, eel pots, traps (excluding
    crab traps and automobile tires), and hand-crank electrofishers
    where authorized by local law.
     Special fishing devices may only be used in waters having
    designated seasons. See list (by county) under “Seasons and
    Waters” on pages 29–32.
     A noncommercial special device license is valid when no more
    than three special devices, regardless of type, are used.
     A commercial special device license is required when four or
    more special devices, regardless of type, are used.
     Hand-crank electrofishers are any manually operated device
    capable of generating a low-voltage electrical current, not to
    exceed 300 volts, for the taking of catfish.
    http://www.ncwildlife.org/Regs/2009_10/2009_10_NonGame_Fish.pdf
     
  4. beenthere

    Retired Moderator

    Apr 20, 2004
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    The "hand cranked" limitation is quite significant. The ones I built ran on 240 VAC @ 20 amps. That would be like machine gunning for deer.
     
  5. TheEquineFencer

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Apr 20, 2007
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    I asked if I could use a hand crank to charge a battery, then discharge the battery, he told me it did not matter to him as long as i did not go over 300 Volts output, to him it was "hand cranked' and he was the one that would write a ticket if it did was his interpitation of the rules. It was hand cranked. He was quite keen on the idea himself. If I get one built he's going fishing with me. I need something to eat without spending all day on the creek. I'm getting tired of Deer and sweet potatoes and such.
     
  6. BMorse

    Senior Member

    Sep 26, 2009
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    shouldn't be too hard to generate 300+ VDC with a Permanent magnet DC motor and a Voltage Doubler circuit..... (of course, you will need more components than that but this should get you going in the right direction), build the system almost like one of those crank flashlights, but much bigger of course, so you can store some of the power from the DC motor in some caps or batteries, which in turn would power the circuit to generate the High Voltage output...
    Getting the amperage up to shock the fish is another thing....

    My .02
     
  7. TheEquineFencer

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Apr 20, 2007
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    I was thinking along the lines of a 12VDC batery charged by a hand cranked generator, running some kind of invertor from the battery stepping the voltage up to 300VDC, do you think 300VAC would work better? I'm wondering if I used a transformer to step A/C voltage up from a 120VAC output inverter to 360VAC or 480VAC and then use a diode to rectify it to VDC would work, that would only give me roughly 1/2 of the VAC, that would put me around 180VDC-240VDC, am I right?
     
  8. BMorse

    Senior Member

    Sep 26, 2009
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    You could use a type of DC to DC step up converter circuit using an audio transformer and a Mosfet to switch it at the right frequency, then you could run the output of the transformer through a rectifier and some diodes (1N4007's or similar) and caps, rated at around 250 to 300 volts, set up multiple stages of the voltage doubler until you get the desired output....

    But increasing the current output would still be a challenge....

    My .02
     
  9. beenthere

    Retired Moderator

    Apr 20, 2004
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    We will leave this thread go on, but anybody reading this and making plans to do his own shocker should be strongly cautioned that it can result in a stiff fine and imprisonment for using such a device. Check your Fish & Wildlife codes very thoroughly before you start dangling wires in the creek.

    I am not sure I would play fast and loose with the definition of "hand-cranked", either. Word gets around.
     
  10. Wendy

    Moderator

    Mar 24, 2008
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    I prefer dynamite myself. :p

    What ever happened to old telephone dynamos?
     
  11. SgtWookie

    Expert

    Jul 17, 2007
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    I'm no lawyer (wouldn't want to be one, either...)

    But, I think it's important to keep within the spirit of the law.

    Like, bow & arrow is OK, but not crossbows. The crossbow allows you to store energy to use later, but the bow & arrow doesn't. (the spear gun is an exception, because it's used underwater; you couldn't use a bow & arrow underwater)

    If your fish zapper is hand-cranked and limited to no more than 300v, then you would be within the letter and spirit of the law.

    However, if you start adding in capacitors, then you have a capability of storing or accumulating a charge over a period of time, and using that stored charge at any given time. You're starting to get into a gray area. If the capacitors were anything more than what was necessary to act in a capacity (sic) as a voltage doubler/tripler/quadrupler/etc, then you may be in violation of the spirit, or intent of the law. If the device did not retain any charge when the cranking stopped, then you would likely be OK.

    If you added a battery to the gizmo, then you would have a battery-powered device that was capable of being charged with a hand cranked generator, or any other source of power. That, I believe, would be a violation of the law.

    Like I said from the beginning, I'm no lawyer. I just like to stay out of trouble.
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2009
  12. TheEquineFencer

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Apr 20, 2007
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    http://www.ncwildlife.org/Regs/2009_...nGame_Fish.pdf

    I think the 300 Volt limit is because above that and you can start getting the fish with scales, like bass and such from what the game warden was telling me, that's when you start having a problem.
    I'd love to use a handcranked one if I had one, I guess I'd have to figure out how to get 300VDC max out of a hand crank, but use some electronics to do it.
    You are correct, in some states they are illegal, some require a permit, North Carolina,USA just requires a fishing lic and a 300 Volt limit,and you can just keep the "non-game" fish; Catfish, carp, and such. I'd like to have some of the 10-40 pound catfish I see caught from time to time on a regular basis myself.
    Does anyone have plans for 300VDC hand cranked generator?
     
  13. SgtWookie

    Expert

    Jul 17, 2007
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    I don't happen to have plans for one, however do you have any military surplus shops or swap meets around?

    You might try to find one of the old military field phones; they had a hand cranked generator that could put out a pretty good amount of electricity to alert the phone on the other end of the wire to pick up the handset.

    If you had one of those, about all you would need to do is to add some MOVs (metal oxide varistors) rated for 300v across the output to make sure you didn't generate more voltage than the law allows. Using 270V MOVs would make it more certain that you didn't approach the limit.
     
  14. CDRIVE

    Senior Member

    Jul 1, 2008
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    Since the spirit of this regulation was based on a crank device, it also begs this question.. Is the 300V limit, RMS or Peak?
     
  15. SgtWookie

    Expert

    Jul 17, 2007
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    That's a good question.

    Maybe we should try to determine what they meant by "generator".

    I usually think of a generator as providing DC, as in the old-fashioned generators in autos/trucks before alternators were available.

    If it creates AC, I think of it as an alternator - even if the AC is rectified and regulated, like it is in an automotive alternator.

    But unless it was clarified by the powers that be, I think that the only really safe (and completely legal) thing to do would be to keep the peak to peak voltage at, or under, 300v.
     
  16. TheEquineFencer

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Apr 20, 2007
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    I'll check into the PTP or RMS Monday, I'm guessing it RMS.
     
  17. SgtWookie

    Expert

    Jul 17, 2007
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    As long as you're asking, find out if AC is OK, or if it is supposed to be DC only.
     
  18. TheEquineFencer

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Apr 20, 2007
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    I'll check on that too. It'll probably be Monday before i get an answer.
     
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