fax and pbx ?

Discussion in 'Computing and Networks' started by Mathematics!, Nov 8, 2009.

  1. Mathematics!

    Thread Starter Senior Member

    Jul 21, 2008
    1,022
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    Ok , I am at a company that has a PBX box and they have extensions to access different phones in their building.

    Is it possible to have a fax machines on the same line as the phones all where on and just use a different extension for it. That way you won't have to pay for a seperate line and you get the benifit of not screwing up the fax data comeing in?

    Is it possible ? If so how would you send a fax thru microsoft fax program to the fax machine would you put the number followed by a # and then the extension?

    Just curious seems like PBX should beable to do for fax machines what it does for phones. ( that is make it seem like they are all on seperate lines)

    Let me know if anybody knows or has any experenice in this area.

    Thanks again
     
  2. AlexR

    Well-Known Member

    Jan 16, 2008
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    As far as the phone line or PBX is concerned the fax machine is just another phone and you would dial the fax machine exactly the same way you would dial any other phone extension. The precise method of dialling a given extension will depend on the PBX box.
     
  3. harrywellskin

    New Member

    Dec 18, 2009
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    That's a good question. PBX services is bundled with lots of options, PBX system is integrated with phone lines and computing system as well as internet faxing. Here are some reviews about pbx service provider. <snip>
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 18, 2009
  4. john13busa

    New Member

    Jan 3, 2010
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    First question I would ask is are the phones digital, Number of wires to each extension. Most PBX systems are capable of being set up for analog interfaces.
     
  5. nathanboothe

    New Member

    Feb 17, 2010
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    0
    PBX systems can have multiple lines. A fax machine will just be another extensions just like all the other phone lines. By the way, why the heck are you still using a fax machine when you can replace it with internet faxing? You wouldn't be asking this question in this forum if you are using this better alternative.
     
  6. BMorse

    Senior Member

    Sep 26, 2009
    2,675
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    Here at our company we had our fax machine (PC based Fax viewer for standard and web based faxes, no need to print a fax when most are junk anyways!!) but the person sending the fax has to know that they have to include 2 pauses and then a #, then the extension number, which becomes a pain in the A$$!! to explain to some folks..... so we just installed a dedicated line for the fax PC :)
     
  7. retched

    AAC Fanatic!

    Dec 5, 2009
    5,201
    312
    Many, many companies use a pbx extension as a fax line. At a company I worked at a few years back, I shared an office with a fax machine that was on an extension.


    "Thank you for calling. If you know your parties extension, you can type it at any time. To leave a message in the general box press '9'. To send a fax press '777'."
     
  8. Mathematics!

    Thread Starter Senior Member

    Jul 21, 2008
    1,022
    4
    Ok , I have one last thought.

    Can you some how set your fax machine / computer V.92 modem to pickup before the answering machine on the same line by having people dial a few extra numbers /tones down the line after they dial your number.

    I am not talking about a PBX this would cost to much but the computer fax or fax machine should beable to be set to pick up before the answering machine dynamically.
    Maybe the newer fax machines or fax software has this capablity?

    This would really be nice since then you could have a fax machine or fax computer on the same phone line as the answering machine and set the fax machine to pickup after 2 rings only if you had the extra tones down the line after your phone number...

    But now that I think about it the extra tones would be after the phone is off the hook or a device has picked up... defeating the purpose so I don't think this would be possible....

    But I am wondering if the phone company has a seperate plan or some service other then getting a seperate line where the above thought could work like allowing people to send extra digits after the phone number is dialed to send these to the person your calling so that a fax device can be place to listen for these to indicate a fax message from a voice message.

    For example
    perhaps a person dials your number (231)-123-4567 #FAX
    So if the person dials (231)-123-4567 the fax machine thinks its a regular voice message and never picks up. But if the person dials
    (231)-123-4567 #FAX the fax machine on the other end is engaged because it specifies the #FAX indicator down the line....

    Since caller id info is sent between the first and second rings I don't see why the phone company cann't offer some optional FSK bits down the line for the indicators for you for a reasonable extra price which is maybe a dollar or 2 a month or something...

    Just a thought curious if anybody knows of such a thing or has thought of this before???
    These optional FSK bits for the caller id info could be used for other things then this....

    From anywhere from fax / voice message use to turning on your oven or washer or dryer ,...etc with a remote 256 bit AES encryption password and a phone line plugged into a device on the oven ,...etc to remotely turn on/shut off the oven based on your password......

    Thanks I enjoyed this thread
     
  9. rjenkins

    AAC Fanatic!

    Nov 6, 2005
    1,015
    69
    A sending Fax machine (or fax modem) puts an identification tone on the line so whatever answers can identify it. Modem data calls do a similar thing, but a different pitch tone.

    Combined phone/fax/answering machines automatically use this to route none-fax calls to the phone/answering machine, while faxes are received.

    You can also buy stand-alone boxes that connect inline with the phone and fax to route the incoming call appropriately, eg. 'Fax Friend' and others.
    (This is a common UK style, I'm sure there are equivalents for other areas:
    http://toddesigns.co.uk/acatalog/fax_friend.html )

    Some others have more features. I had one years ago that had (I think) four outputs and could route to extension phones as well as a fax and a modem, by hitting a key in the second or two after it answered.


    I think in the USA you can have two numbers on the same line using 'distinctive ring' to identify which number is being called. I know Asterisk can use the distincive ring cadence to indentify the call, I don't know if other devices can.

    Have a look at Asterisk and FreePBX, if you are going to leave a PC running for a modem based system, those two together give you full PBX and optionally software fax capability.
     
  10. Mathematics!

    Thread Starter Senior Member

    Jul 21, 2008
    1,022
    4
    Well if I use Asterisk or FreePBX on my computer that has the V.92 fax/data/voice modem will I need extra hardware to go with this software I am not willing to buy expensive hardware.

    Also if no extra stuff is needed other then installing the Asterisk software then where do I connect all the phone lines to. I would connect the main line coming from the telephone company to the V.92 computer modem but where from their do I connect all the phone jacks to because the modem must receive the phone call and the software must route it to the correct phone / fax machine ( so their must be some special hardware or something I need with it unless I am overlooking something)

    On the v.92 modem their is 2 RJ11 jacks one with a phone icon on and the other with nothing on it..
    What is the difference for?

    Thanks
     
  11. rjenkins

    AAC Fanatic!

    Nov 6, 2005
    1,015
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    For fax and answering machine, everything can be done in software within the PC.
    There is a software interface (iax modem) which connects Asterisk to Hylafax.

    I have my system set up so the asterisk system receives the fax then emails it to me.
    To send a fax, I print to an alternate 'printer' from any PC in the house.

    There are many cheap gadgets to add phone ports that can work with Asterisk.
    (You can buy dedicated PCI cards, but these can be expensive.)
    The cheapest option is something like a Sipura SPA1000 / SPA2000 / SPA3000 series box.

    These just connect to your ethernet system and add phone jacks wherever you want.
    The SPA1001 is about $30 on ebay.

    You can also get digital (SIP) phones from many companies which connect directly via ethernet. Makes are such as Polycom, Sipura, Cisco etc.
    These are again quite cheap on ebay and give full business style control over calls.

    Some newer ADSL routers also have phone outlets and built-in SIP clients to work with VoIP systems. I'd expect one of these would also work to provide phone extensions on an asterisk PBX.

    I even have my cell phone set up to register as an extension on the asterisk system when I'm at home so I can answer land line calls on it. (It's a Nokia E65 which includes WiFi and a SIP client).


    (The second connector on a typical modem is a loop through for a normal phone. )
     
  12. Mathematics!

    Thread Starter Senior Member

    Jul 21, 2008
    1,022
    4
    If I get distinctive ring one for a fax and 2 more for 2 seperate phone numbers

    Questions

    Is their away I can have astrickes or freepbx route the distinctive rings coming in on my computers V.92 modem to a specific device plugged into one of the given ethernet ports of my router/switch?

    If so will I need some hardware or can I directly plug my phone/fax machines using a cat5e cord into the routers ethernet ports?
    ( what hardware if needed to work with the router to beable to use phone and fax on it?)

    Just to make sure I don't have VOIP any more just POTS for phone and Cable for internet/TV.

    I am trying to have the main line go thru my v.92 computer modem then have some software (like astrickes or freepbx ) route it to a device plugged into the ethernet router and have?
    Main question here is can this software route incoming calls coming in from my V.92 modem out the NIC card to the ethernet router network ...etc.

    Never really used this software before so just making sure everything will work once I install it ...
     
  13. BMorse

    Senior Member

    Sep 26, 2009
    2,675
    234

    You will toast something for sure trying that, for one phone cords are RJ11, network ethernet cable is RJ45, these 2 are not compatible or interchangeable with each other.....


    What OS are you running on your PC, if it is windows based , I am not sure if Asterisk or FreePBX will run on your PC....

     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2010
  14. Mathematics!

    Thread Starter Senior Member

    Jul 21, 2008
    1,022
    4
    Yes but is their a device that allows you to plug your POTS phone into your ethernet router/switch ?

    Because if so then their should be a way if the Asterisk software can route the incoming calls from the V.92 modem to the router/switch devices then their should be no problem in having distinctive ring and the software route my calls to the proper devices on the router/switch.

    If ofcourse devices exist to plug into ethernet ports and have outputs to an RJ11 phone jack on them.

    Also these device if they exist must convert the 2.2 or 2.8volts on the cat5 to 90ac 20 hz for ringing and equivalent for fax machines stuff etc..

    Anybody know if it is possible ( that is do they mak devices to convert phone lines to work on ethernet jacks thur some computer hosting software to route calls to different ethernet ports based on distinctive ring or caller id ,...etc etc

    Thanks
     
  15. rjenkins

    AAC Fanatic!

    Nov 6, 2005
    1,015
    69
    Yes, there are many SIP- and IAX-protocol devices that connect to ethernet and allow telephone extenstions (or in some cases phone lines) to be connected.

    The Sipura gadgets I mentioned in my last post are examples of these, have a look on ebay or the Linksys / Sipura web site for info.

    You would need to check your existing modem has a suitable driver to work with Asterisk, otherwise look for an SPA3000 series interface as these have one jack for the incoming phone line and another to connect back out the a telephone.

    (You can't use FreePBX without Asterisk; asterisk is the actual PBX, but it's configuration language is a nightmare to learn. FreePBX is a human-friendly front end that produces all the config files and adds various features.)

    You obviously need a dedicated PC to run it on, but as you originally mentioned using a modem to accept calls I presume that is not a problem.

    ps. BMorse - Actually, the Ethernet / RJ45 pinout was designed so jacks could be dual-wired, a telephone RJ11 connects perfectly using the center (blue) pair, which was not used by Ethernet prior to the introduction of the Gigabit standard.
    Either way, plugging a phone directly into a router would be neither useful or harmful.
     
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