Discussion on new FSM chapter

Thread Starter

tshuck

Joined Oct 18, 2012
3,534
Multisim is about as far as you can get from free. $5k for the full edition.

It's built to be integrated with LabVIEW which is also far from free.

It uses slightly different simulation engine, but LTSpice is easy to use once you add enough models manually from the Spice group download.

MultiSim comes with UltiBoard, a PCB Routing utility that is pretty decent, supporting lots of layers, though hand routing is generally faster for small circuits, even on a fast machine (for reasons given above).

Each sim has their own pros and cons, but LTSpice is the best free simulator around. The ease of plotting outputs by clicking is nice. In multisim, an oscilloscope or function generator need to be connected as a physical one would, but then you have a realtime adjustment of both function gen and scope while simulation is running. In LTSpice, adding sweep steps and plotting the output is the closest it can come to the same functionality. The real "instruments" and realtime modification of signals, in addition to PIC MCU hex code runtime simulation (Which Proteus, another non-free tool offers), boost the cost a good deal.
Thanks!

I tend to stick with a single simulator/layout editor/schematic capture/etc. when I design, I've been meaning to check some other ones out for times I talk with others, but haven't gotten around to it yet.:(

I'm wondering how all of the Indian students that can't figure out how to flash a LED can afford both Proteus and Multisim..:confused:then again, I am assuming they are paying for it...
 

Georacer

Joined Nov 25, 2009
5,182
Don't make assumptions without indications. But piracy aside, there are many ways a student can have access to professional software. My university has an agreement with Microsoft and we get free Windows licenses. Moreover, we have a cloud service that runs online Matlab, Eclipse and a few other less useful ones.

Yes, I have used Multisim, to which I have access. If you don't care for real time output plots, you don't have to connect any o-scope block; it has a very nice simulation menu to generate outputs.

I haven't seen any restriction to free tools for the e-book.
 

thatoneguy

Joined Feb 19, 2009
6,359
I'm wondering how all of the Indian students that can't figure out how to flash a LED can afford both Proteus and Multisim..:confused:then again, I am assuming they are paying for it...
From how often people post basic questions regarding Multisim or Proteus, I'm guessing they are available on a pirate torrent site or something.
 

Thread Starter

tshuck

Joined Oct 18, 2012
3,534
I haven't seen any restriction to free tools for the e-book.
I'm guessing it was Tony that wrote this, but under the "A note on software used in the books" section, it says,
One restriction beyond the Design Science License that I feel compelled to place upon contributors is a prohibition against the use of non-free software in the authoring of this book series.
Is this no longer enforced, or cared for?
 

Georacer

Joined Nov 25, 2009
5,182
Hm... I haven't noticed that restriction. Thanks for bringing it up.

I think the idea behind that restriction was if the reader wanted to run the same simulations for the circuits displayed in pages like this one (http://www.allaboutcircuits.com/vol_2/chpt_5/3.html), he could directly compare the results.

My schematic isn't meant to be simulated nor have I posted a computer generated output. It's purely theoretical, it could have been done by hand.

However, there is the minor issue of visual continuity. I may download XCircuit and try to re-make the schematic.
 

Thread Starter

tshuck

Joined Oct 18, 2012
3,534
I think the idea behind that restriction was if the reader wanted to run the same simulations for the circuits displayed in pages like this one (http://www.allaboutcircuits.com/vol_2/chpt_5/3.html), he could directly compare the results.
That's more, or less, my feelings regarding the use of free software...

However, there is the minor issue of visual continuity. I may download XCircuit and try to re-make the schematic.
I downloaded it, open the folder, realized it was all source files and there wasn't a project file and no instructions to compile it in Windows. I promptly closed it... I haven't taken the time to go back and figure it out, but I will probably do that at some point...for now, all of my images are quickly-drawn, MSPaint images:D
 

Thread Starter

tshuck

Joined Oct 18, 2012
3,534
I just realized there are two chapters on FSMs. The one Geo wrote and this one from chapter 16.

Perhaps merging that into the FSM chapter is in order...
 

Georacer

Joined Nov 25, 2009
5,182
To be honest, I didn't know that that article existed. I gave it a read and it's a good general all-around text.

Mine focuses on building the FSM with FFs and logic gates. The older one describes the FSM generally, in a context of a Lookup table / ROM.

I think both fit best in the chapter they are now, but they sure must be linked somehow.

I really like the intro of the older article, but I don't think mine would fit that late in the book.

I 'm in a dilemma here: I want the older article to serve as an intro to FSMs, but since it's based on ROMs and lookup tables it can't go any earlier in the book.

Any thoughts here?
 

Thread Starter

tshuck

Joined Oct 18, 2012
3,534
Perhaps a splicing of the two? Taking the introduction of the older one, putting it with yours and directing the reader to there for a specific implementation...
 

Georacer

Joined Nov 25, 2009
5,182
If you cut the older article just above the first figure, then it can precede mine. But then the gray code example is pretty basic to be put after my article.

If you include it, then there isn't much left and you refer to ROMs before they are introduced.

Or maybe I 'm just too picky. I would choose the first option if I had to.
 

Thread Starter

tshuck

Joined Oct 18, 2012
3,534
I meant more along the lines of using the introduction of the older one in yours, then telling the reader to go to chapter 16 for an implementation for a ROM-based state machine. I think the older article would need to be renamed also, perhaps "Implementing a FSM with a ROM"...

I think at the very least, your article should occur first in the book, as yours is more detailed...
 
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