Avalanch robot

Discussion in 'The Projects Forum' started by berthus@online.no, Feb 8, 2012.

  1. berthus@online.no

    Thread Starter New Member

    Feb 8, 2012
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    Helo i am a new member inn this forum, and have a smal problem (for You) i would like to have hjelp with.

    I am an instructor in dog avalanch rescue and have biuld a robot for training purpose.

    In short terms it works like this.

    I dig down a box, whitch i Can remotely turn on/off severel aids for the dog.

    My problem is: i Get a controll signal, that shows me if the aid is on. But i Can only send one at the time.

    Therefor, Can someone help my construct a circuit that starts when a rele (rele) is turned on (both NO and NC) and stay on for like 4 secunds (used to send the controll on signal). Then turn off (goes to ground). And when the rele is released a new 4 secunds is giwen (controll signal off) it Can take up to 20 min before its turned off.
    I have 12 v
    To make it more difficult, there are 4 aids tatt needs this.

    Best regards

    Tor Øyvind
    Norway
     
  2. nerdegutta

    Moderator

    Dec 15, 2009
    2,517
    785
    Hi, there. :)

    Do you have a picture or a schematic of your robot?


    What is happening when you turn it on?
    What does it do?
    Make noise or some kind of movement?


    Can you please explain a bit more.

    This is a very interesting subject.
     
  3. berthus@online.no

    Thread Starter New Member

    Feb 8, 2012
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    0
    Here is a simpel overwiew off the robot side (the remote unit works great).

    As you may se in the scematic.
    I can turn on breathing air solonoid (there is an air tank in the boks).
    I can turn on a heat element (the element is inside clothes witch are from the same person as the breathing air)
    I can turn on a S/R (sender / reciver, a standard electronic avalanch search device)
    And i can turn it all on/off, when off only the S/R works.

    Do not hesitate to ask for more questions.

     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2012
  4. nerdegutta

    Moderator

    Dec 15, 2009
    2,517
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    Ok...

    I need a bit more explanation.

    Let me see if I got this right. The main goal/endstate is that the dog finds the box and starts digging/barking. Right?

    A walkthrugh

    • You bury the box in snow
    • Then your team/dog, starts searching for the box
    • If they are off track/way off, you can give small hints

    You need help to design a circuit to help you set off the hints.

    Correct or am I way off?
     
  5. berthus@online.no

    Thread Starter New Member

    Feb 8, 2012
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    Thats about correct.
    I dont giwe hints, i only choose the senc source (air and/ore Heat).

    Normaly we would hawe to burry a person, this giwes a enorm mass off sent and i werry different from a real burryed boddy. and it is werry much work to burry a person.

    This way we can test out the dog, how long after a person has stoppet breathing can a dog sens him.
    Its commond that we can have trubbel finding people that has been burryed for long time (and stopped breathig). we hope that this robot will give us a tool to teach the dogs to react at a lower amount off sent.

    I need help to design a circuit that produses the delayed off signals.
    Now it is sending the controllsignal all the time i have the feks air solonoid on, and i have to turn it off to start (eks) heat
    Hope this helps.

     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2012
  6. nerdegutta

    Moderator

    Dec 15, 2009
    2,517
    785
    You can do this either with a 555 timer IC chip or with a microcontroller.

    Have a look at this.

    But with a uC, the part count will be smaller than with a 555-IC.
     
  7. berthus@online.no

    Thread Starter New Member

    Feb 8, 2012
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    0
    I am werry god with dogs, but not so god at designing circuit.

    I have looked at the 555 solution. and yes this may be the thing. but i havent found a circuit that does what i need.

    the circuit is normaly off, and after rele (eks heat)engages, the circuit stays on for 2-4 sec, then turns off (alltough the rele stil is engaged) and stays off until rele releases.
    then when it realeses, turns on for a new 2-4 sec.

    the (eks) heat rele is a normal ssrele with NO, C, NC. the NO is conected to the heat element.
    The NC is today conected to a new reley (to get a new NO solution), that again is connected to a switch in the RF sender.

    The RF sender and reciver are standard 4 ch remote switch (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/4-CH-315M-RF-Wireless-Remote-Control-Controller-w-case-/150592193794)
    There is one off each inn the robot and inn the remote controll.

    In the remote controll.
    4 switches (from the rf sender) when eks heat is pushed, it turns on heat, and controll signal is sendt back to remote unit and the reciver turns on the heat led. this shows me wath is on/off.

    Thanks so much for your interes so far.

     
  8. nerdegutta

    Moderator

    Dec 15, 2009
    2,517
    785
    That helps a lot and it is a bit clearer of what you want to achieve.

    I'll do some thinking, and perhaps draw something, then maybe someone else says: "Forget it, it won't work because bla bla bla...." something we didn't think of. :)

    It is a very interesting subject, and I'm sure we can make something. :)

    Do you have a deadline, or do the dogs have to be ready by winter vacation (is that week 8 now?) or Easter?
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2012
  9. berthus@online.no

    Thread Starter New Member

    Feb 8, 2012
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    That sounds fantastic.
    i dont have a deadline, this is yust to improve my prosject. thoug it would be nice to know what is turned on.
    There is a big cource in week 11, there i will use this. and it would be nice to have it ready then.

     
  10. nerdegutta

    Moderator

    Dec 15, 2009
    2,517
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    Do you have any data for the solenoid, heater and the S/R?
    How big is your box?
     
  11. berthus@online.no

    Thread Starter New Member

    Feb 8, 2012
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    There is plenty off space inside the pellycase.

    the element is 12 v 45 w (could have been smaller, but works, and is cheep)
    the solonoid is 12 v ( i can find moore data if recuired)
    and the S/R is a Mamut Barryvox pulse, this only recuier 4,5v, so i only use the rele to start this ( use its one battery)

    The battery is a 12v 17ah gel batteri (motorcycle battery)

    :)
     
  12. nerdegutta

    Moderator

    Dec 15, 2009
    2,517
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    Is it correct that the heating element draws approximately 4Amps?

    Do you have some data for the solenoid?

    About the Mammut Barryvox. Is that turned on all the time, or do you turn it on with the remote control... And if that is the case, how?
     
  13. nerdegutta

    Moderator

    Dec 15, 2009
    2,517
    785
    I've read our dialog a few times, and I got confused. (I'm easily confused...:rolleyes:)

    This is what I got now, see att. I went for a 555 timer solution.

    The thought is:
    X1 is connected to battery. This is the power to the IC.
    X2 is connected to NO on the relay.
    X3 is connected to the heater/solenoid.

    Questions that arise:


    • How is the receiver circuit triggered? One push on - one push off?
    • If you press the A-button, is the buried circuit "locked"? Meaning that you need to turn off the relay connected to the A-button to turn it off, and then the rest of the relays are "free" to be engaged?

    Feel free to enable the Private Message feature and send a PM to me... in Norwegian... :)

    EDIT: Just did some re-calculations. I've think I've done it wrong in the attachment.

    1.1 x 400 x 100 = 44 000 sec. Sorry for that.

    The formula is correct, though...

    Maybe if we use:
    T=1.1 x 40 x 0.1uF = 4.4 sec
     
    Last edited: Feb 10, 2012
  14. berthus@online.no

    Thread Starter New Member

    Feb 8, 2012
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    0
    I am impressed.

    Yes it uses push on and push off. And no, i need not turn off the first before turning on a new. but i only have one controll lamp working (becuse the first block next).

    And yes my english is poor, so be fre to use my email <SNIP>
    Will leave the tread alive for others to comment.

     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 9, 2012
  15. berthus@online.no

    Thread Starter New Member

    Feb 8, 2012
    8
    0
    Helo again. i have not yet buildt the circuit you have designed. burt will order the parts soon.
    Heres a picture off the robot as it is now.
    The bateri i not in the picture, and the heat element is build inn the topp cover (not seen) I found one smaler 10 W, and hope this will work as well.

    Thanks for your help so far.

    [​IMG]
     
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