Atmospheric Ion Collector Tower AC/DC Voltage Questions

Discussion in 'General Electronics Chat' started by Hideo_Xx, Nov 10, 2014.

  1. Hideo_Xx

    Thread Starter New Member

    Oct 26, 2014
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    This is my first post on this website. If I am not in the right section/or have done something wrong please notify me.

    Short and simple. I have constructed a tower outside my home, roughly 14ft to see if I could generate any electricity from it. I was getting a .524 AC reading on my meter and anywhere between 3.5mV to about 80mV for a DC reading. (keep in mind this was for experimental purposes only, not to actually do anything with)

    I made a diode rectifier to convert the AC I was getting. With the diode rectifier It jumped to 1.6 volts AC and about 1.2 DC. I'm assuming this is because of the voltage drop in the diodes. The AC/DC voltage readings are non linear. They change frequently but never go below at least 1 volt. I was able to charge a capacitor to about 1.8 volts and light a small LED.

    My first question is How can I amplify this voltage to something more usable? I have read about single stage transistors, 2-3 stage amplifiers, op-amps, voltage multipliers, boost converters and just about anything else. The thing is, my knowledge is limited. I have downloaded all the e-books provided on this website and I am only halfway through book one. I have maybe a slightly just above average knowledge of electrical concepts/components. So the things I do find on how to do this are hard for me to understand at this moment.

    My second question is, obviously I do not know how to use transistors. I have NpN and PnP type but I do not know how to configure them in a circuit so they would amplify the AC or DC voltage a am getting. I have seen a lot of schematics with wires/capacitors/resistors all going to different parts of the NpN transistor and it is very confusing. And I have tried to construct everything I have listed above but to no end as I just do not understand it yet.

    My third question is how can I slowly release energy from a capacitor? To keep an LED lit for anything more than 1 second.

    If someone can explain this in very, very simple terms that I can understand it would be great.
    The problems I run into when I google something is that I come across very detailed explanations, but with terms/definitions and I have no idea what I am reading.

    Again, if anyone could help explain how to amplify this it would be a great help. Thank you.
     
  2. Sensacell

    Well-Known Member

    Jun 19, 2012
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    1) An amplifier does not create power out of nothing, it uses the input signal to create a larger copy of the input signal from the energy of it's power source, i.e. battery, power supply etc.
    No free lunch.

    2) See #1 above.

    3) Keeping the LED lit longer requires more stored energy, you could charge a larger capacitor, but it will take longer to charge.
    Again, no free lunches in this life.
     
  3. BR-549

    Well-Known Member

    Sep 22, 2013
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    Dear Hideo Xx,
    What do you do for a living? And may I ask what your education is in?

    I have probably read 1/2 book about it, and I don’t understand and I am confused.
    Can you explain in very very simple terms your knowledge so I can understand what you understand?

    There are many answers to your questions.....but you need to know the basics to understand the answers.

    I suggest you study the textbook on this site. Any question or confusion will be answered here quickly.

    Start at the beginning and read it like a novel. When something doesn’t make sense to you......Stop and ask for help.
     
  4. alfacliff

    Well-Known Member

    Dec 13, 2013
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    you are picking up a radio station nearby. the diode rectifies the rf and the reason it varies is the modulation, voice or music.
     
  5. Hideo_Xx

    Thread Starter New Member

    Oct 26, 2014
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    Thanks everyone. As a response to BR-549, that is what I am doing. I started with book 1 provided on this website and intend to read them all.
    Thank you Alfacliff, that is what I suspected, but wasn't for sure. Thank you for confirming:)

    As for Sensacell, if I am understanding this correctly the transistor would need an external power supply to amplify the voltage I am getting from the tower? If so, how would I create a circuit that does this? The problems I have is, if I have an external power supply, say a 12 (V) battery, and I have the tower outside producing 1.2 (V) DC. I would connect the 12 (V) battery to the transistor in order for it to amplify the 1.2 (V) from the tower? But how would I connect it to the transistor, what would go to the base, collector, emitter? And how would the output be put across two wires? I have seen several things where an amplifier has been able to boost a very low AC or DC, between .5 (mV) to 2 (V), to like 10 (V) or even 12(V). How is this accomplished?
     
  6. wayneh

    Expert

    Sep 9, 2010
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    It's accomplished, as noted, by using the tiny signal to control power provided by another source such as a battery or wall wart. Think transistor radio. If your power source is RF from a nearby radio station, a transistor radio is the perfect amplifier to use.

    There have been endless attempts to pull useful energy out of thin air. They usually fail. The energy is far too diffuse and if it isn't, that means you're near power lines and will get prosecuted for stealing energy, or you're just leaching off a radio station.
     
  7. Hideo_Xx

    Thread Starter New Member

    Oct 26, 2014
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    Okay, a transistor radio is what I will look into. Thank you Wayneh. Speaking of pulling energy out of the air, has anyone ever visited Ion Power Group in Florida? They produce enormous amounts of electricity from the air. It was quite a thing to see. Very interesting. Of course their towers are 132ft and they have 4 of them. Slightly better than my little 14 ft:(

    I just googled transistor radio, how would incorporate this into my circuit?All I came across was audio amplifier and converting one into a guitar amp. where would I input my supply voltage and tower voltage? and where would the output voltage be?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 12, 2014
  8. Alec_t

    AAC Fanatic!

    Sep 17, 2013
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    That's what they like the public to believe. Conspiracy theorists would more likely reckon it's a covert monitoing station for communicationg with extra-terrestials ;).
     
    BR-549 likes this.
  9. Hideo_Xx

    Thread Starter New Member

    Oct 26, 2014
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    Oh don't get me started on conspiracy theories.......I'm addicted to that stuff....lol. Curse you Ancient Aliens!
     
  10. Kermit2

    AAC Fanatic!

    Feb 5, 2010
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    first you need to measure the current(amperes flowing) from your ion capture tower. this current multiplied by the voltage will tell you how much POWER the tower is capturing. you CANNOT increase this. it is what you have captured. you can transform it by raising the voltage but current will be reduced.
    think of it as a pizza. the entire pizza represents the power you have captured. No matter how you transform it, voltage higher or lower. No matter how many ways you slice it up, you still only have the original pizza.
     
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  11. alfacliff

    Well-Known Member

    Dec 13, 2013
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    the atmospheric tower collection sounds like something I read about long ago about the voltage gradient in the atmosphere. you could collect power, if it were perfectly insulated to the very tip. unfortunatly a perfect insulator does not exist. kind of like the two satelites with a tether between them collecting power.
     
  12. Hideo_Xx

    Thread Starter New Member

    Oct 26, 2014
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    That is exactly what Ion Power group does. They have four 132 ft towers using a graphene/graphite tether between them. All of their patents are available, though I couldn't make much sense of their capture device on the towers. Anyway,

    Kermit2, when you say transform it by raising the voltage. Are you referring to amplifying the voltage using a transistor? Or something along those lines? If so, would anyone be willing to provide a circuit design or schematic on how I could do this?
     
  13. BobTPH

    Active Member

    Jun 5, 2013
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    You still misunderstand what an amplifier does. It is of no use for extracting more power from your tower. Neither is a boost converter. Neither is any other circuit.

    Bob
     
  14. Hideo_Xx

    Thread Starter New Member

    Oct 26, 2014
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    So was wayneh incorrect in suggesting a radio transistor? And what about everything I have read about boosting low voltages into higher ones using those components. I'm not saying you are wrong, your right I don't understand it to much. But I do understand I can not simply connect a transistor to my tower and expect 10 (V) out of it. I have to have an external supply, correct? I am just wondering what kind of components can do this and how to connect it all together. Not trying to create free energy here lol.
     
  15. wayneh

    Expert

    Sep 9, 2010
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    When I said transistor radio, I was referring to the small, handheld, battery-powered device that became popular when I was a kid, i.e. a long time ago. It was our iPod, and my first one cost $7, which was a big deal for me at the time.

    It was purpose-built to capture and amplify radio frequency energy, turning it into sound.

    That Ion Power thing is a scam designed to separate fools from their money.
     
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  16. Hideo_Xx

    Thread Starter New Member

    Oct 26, 2014
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    Right, I was wondering how I could use of those to help amplify a my tower voltage? Can you reconfigure it to amplify volts instead of sound?
     
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  17. Kermit2

    AAC Fanatic!

    Feb 5, 2010
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    your 'transistor' can amplify a signal/small voltage. it doesn't increase power from the signal source.
    in the old days of radio, tubes were called valves. with a valve a small power, like your hand, can control a larger power, turning it on or off as the little power of your hand ops and closes the va. if you pretend you are the valve/transistor and everytime a single drop of water falls and touches you, you open the valve on a large dam. the valve, you, are amplifying the drop of water. you respond to the tiny drip of water by releasing a huge amount of water at the same rate as the drip is hitting you. the tiny amount of water that drips is now amplified into huge gushes of thousand of gallons. you are not increasing the drip directly but acting as a conduit to allow water from a dam(alarge power source) to flow in an identical fashion to the drip. the power of the water behind the dam is responsible for supplying the huge amounts of water through the valve. the original signal/drip just provides the pattern you replicate by opening and closing the dam.
     
  18. Hideo_Xx

    Thread Starter New Member

    Oct 26, 2014
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    [​IMG] This is the kind of image I am referring to. I think I am understanding this wrong, tell me if I am. So the input would be put across the Base and Emitter The input coming from a source of low voltage, right? And the output would be across the Collector and Emitter? It would be an increase in voltage/signal whatever your trying to amplify? Thank you Kermit2 for your description. I'm slowly starting to get it I believe. If you could just tell me what/how to use my NpN transistor that would be great. Here is what I have, 9 and 12 V batteries. I have resistors 270, 330, 10k Ohm, NpN, PnP transistors. The tower voltage supply. 1.6 AC and 1.2 DC. Myriad of capacitors and so on.
    Would I have to use an outside energy source to amplify the tower voltage through a transistor?
     
  19. alfacliff

    Well-Known Member

    Dec 13, 2013
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    an amplifier like that works by using a small signal to control a larger power. you get no more power out than you put in. nit does not increase the power from whatever source of power it uses.
     
  20. Hideo_Xx

    Thread Starter New Member

    Oct 26, 2014
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    How does it do that? How would it be connected in a circuit?
     
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