Arduino strikes again...

DerStrom8

Joined Feb 20, 2011
2,390
I respectfully submit that a difference exists between 'works' and works well/ "is efficiently applied";)
An excellent point, which I intended to mention in my earlier post but it slipped my mind. Arduinos, unless programmed though an IDE that focuses on the chip itself like AVR Studio, are incredibly inefficient, and the libraries are very bulky and there is lots of overhead. Timing is very imprecise and overall performance and efficiency is very poor. Sure, it may work, but think about what you're sacrificing for practically no reason--Memory, accuracy, speed, etc.
 

Thread Starter

Hypatia's Protege

Joined Mar 1, 2015
3,228
@Hypatia's Protege:
"Inasmuch as the article 'comment feature' doesn't seem to work (for opinions at odds with 'the narrative' anyway) I offer my 'take' here:"

Just want to be clear - We approve all comments unless they are spam. They are manually approved, however. You posted late at night, I approved it when I woke. Enough with the drama perhaps?
Thank you! -- Please know that I 'cooled' the drama considerably even before seeing my comment 'go up':oops::)

FWIW -- Upon submission of my comment I received an orange screen advising that I was not logged in -- when I was?:confused:

Best regards
HP
 

DerStrom8

Joined Feb 20, 2011
2,390
Thank you! -- Please know that I 'cooled' the drama considerably even before seeing my comment 'go up':oops::)

FWIW -- Upon submission of my comment I received an orange screen advising that I was not logged in -- when I was?:confused:

Best regards
HP
I have seen this bug multiple times, it is very common upon switching between the forums and the "Home" tab (which I always try to avoid but occasionally it happens anyway).
 

Thread Starter

Hypatia's Protege

Joined Mar 1, 2015
3,228
An excellent point, which I intended to mention in my earlier post but it slipped my mind. Arduinos, unless programmed though an IDE that focuses on the chip itself like AVR Studio, are incredibly inefficient, and the libraries are very bulky and there is lots of overhead. Timing is very imprecise and overall performance and efficiency is very poor. Sure, it may work, but think about what you're sacrificing for practically no reason--Memory, accuracy, speed, etc.
Then too are the 'difficult to unlearn' bad habits attendant to use of 'kludges', 'catchalls' and 'universal solutions' - of any description:rolleyes:
 
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mcgyvr

Joined Oct 15, 2009
5,394
I respectfully submit that a difference exists between 'works' and works well/ "is efficiently applied";)
I'm 100% in agreement IF you are trying to build a professional/consumer device where one little "hiccup" could leave you staring at a lawsuit or worse..
At that point you'd better know your micro's registers,etc.. inside and out..
I'm sure as heck not hiring an individual for my Engineering department to design mission critical systems with just Arduino based knowledge.

If software development was my primary career then sure Arduino has major limitations,etc.... (as intended)
But the beauty of Arduino like devices is simply that we don't have to be software programmers with sufficient low level understanding to enjoy the benefits of microprocessing power..

Its just a different tool that makes it much easier (and frankly far less boring) to see a project come to life.

Now back to this sway bar link/car talk.. Arduino vs blah blah has been beaten to death already..

Just put a brand new steering box in my Jeep and the fun of ball joint removal/replacement is next..
 
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Thread Starter

Hypatia's Protege

Joined Mar 1, 2015
3,228
I'm 100% in agreement IF you are trying to build a professional/consumer device where one little "hiccup" could leave you staring at a lawsuit or worse..
At that point you'd better know your micro's registers,etc.. inside and out..
I'm sure as heck not hiring an individual for my Engineering department to design mission critical systems with just Arduino based knowledge.

If software development was my primary career then sure Arduino has major limitations,etc.... (as intended)
But the beauty of Arduino like devices is simply that we don't have to be software programmers with sufficient low level understanding to enjoy the benefits of microprocessing power..

Its just a different tool that makes it much easier (and frankly far less boring) to see a project come to life.
FWIW software (Spec high level vs low level programming) is the least of my 'gripes' -- It is, rather, the de-emphasis of real world concepts (CIP electronics/physics) that I find both disturbing and, frankly, dangerous -- I feel Arduino could have been a useful educational tool --- sadly it has long since entered 'smart phone land' and, in so doing, has fulfilled the 'destiny' of its original concept -- To wit: art (in the pedestrian sense) as opposed to science/technology...

Best regards
HP:)
 

#12

Joined Nov 30, 2010
18,224
Now back to this sway bar link/car talk.. Arduino vs blah blah has been beaten to death already..
I'm afraid that genie is out of the bottle. Before I started on the suspension, I spent a few days fixing the power windows and door locks, and half the functions don't work because one microprocessor can't recognize the key fob buttons and another one can't read the Keypad Entry Code. I did manage to disable the RFID Ignition Switch requirement so it uses $3 keys now instead of the $130 keys from the Ford Dealership, but it was a mighty conquest which required days of reading on the Internet and purchasing a wiring diagram for the car.

I will forever have an idiot light warning me that another microprocessor can't communicate with the tire pressure sensors because I refuse to pay $100 each for a transmitter installed inside each wheel, and I haven't even started on the four sensors that are involved in turning the air conditioner off when the switch says, "on". I might, and might not, figure out how to shut off the idiot light that keeps telling me to change the engine oil because its microprocessor doesn't actually measure anything about removing the drain plug or what color the oil is.

If you think that means I don't like having 20 Arduino like devices in my used car, you're right!
 

Thread Starter

Hypatia's Protege

Joined Mar 1, 2015
3,228
I will forever have an idiot light warning me that another microprocessor can't communicate with the tire pressure sensors because I refuse to pay $100 each for a transmitter installed inside each wheel,
Actually that's a bargain! -- If that's the installed price it's a 'mega' bargain!!!:) --- Still - I suppose $400 is a bit 'dear' for a function that may be completed in less than 5 minutes with a $5 pressure indicator:cool:

because its microprocessor doesn't actually measure anything about removing the drain plug or what color the oil is.
To my knowledge said feature counts 'revs' - while an improvement upon miles or months I prefer to have it changed more often than recommended - A stitch in time and all that:)

Best regards
HP:)
 

#12

Joined Nov 30, 2010
18,224
Actually that's a bargain!
This car has been sitting for 15 months without any visible change in the tires. You might think it's a bargain to pay $100 per tire to have a microprocessor tell you that, but I don't. And, ps, I wouldn't ignore measuring the tire pressures for a year or two if I was driving it. Did I mention, each pressure transmitter uses a battery? Every time the battery goes dead, you have to get the tire removed to replace the battery. If the tire is 6 years old, State Law says an accredited Shop can not reinstall the tire. If you drive quite a bit, you can wear out a $600 set of tires in 6 years, and those are the cheapest tires I could find for this car. If you don't drive much, you get to unnecessarily buy a new $150 tire to accompany each dead battery, which is the size of an antacid tablet. If you don't replace the battery quickly after it dies, it corrodes and takes out the $100 transmitter.

I am thrilled that you make enough money to call this a bargain. Personally, I would be thrilled if this car didn't have that feature.
 

#12

Joined Nov 30, 2010
18,224
To my knowledge said feature counts 'revs'
That's good, but the question is, how does it count me being under the car with a wrench and an oil filter? If it can't figure that out, the idiot light won't go dark.

I assume I will have to read and learn until I find the secret button that I press to tell the microprocessor that I changed the oil...or the car could have one less microprocessor and let me change the oil as I always have...or the microprocessor for that function might have failed and the light will never go dark until I pay a Dealership's Ransom for a new microprocessor.

This seems like an awful lot of complaining, but somebody paid $36,600 for this car, and I have less than $3000 in it today. It's going to cost me another $1000 or $1500 to get most of it "right", and that's what I call a bargain.
 

Thread Starter

Hypatia's Protege

Joined Mar 1, 2015
3,228
You might think it's a bargain to pay $100 per tire to have a microprocessor tell you that, but I don't
Might I draw your attention to the below quoted remark --- IOW I Agree!:)
Still - I suppose $400 is a bit 'dear' for a function that may be completed in less than 5 minutes with a $5 pressure indicator:cool:
Personally, I would be thrilled if this car didn't have that feature.
Agreed -- 'tis merely 'bloat' - extra expense for the consumer with little to no practical benefit:rolleyes:

Did I mention, each pressure transmitter uses a battery? Every time the battery goes dead, you have to get the tire removed to replace the battery.
I purchased a set to 'play with' (i.e. 'reverse engineer' their signals) -- those were entirely 'potted' -- IOW dead battery = dead sender -- and they were $250 a piece!:mad::mad::mad: (hence my statement that "$100 is a bargain" was merely relative - not an endorsement of their supposed 'value'...)

FWIW, my 'specimens' do not output signals below ~3g - meaning, of course, that they are active only above a certain wheel AV --- Unnecessary as they are, I feel the integral accelerometer is 'kinda cool'!:)

Best regards
HP:)
 

Thread Starter

Hypatia's Protege

Joined Mar 1, 2015
3,228
That's good, but the question is, how does it count me being under the car with a wrench and an oil filter? If it can't figure that out, the idiot light won't go dark.

I assume I will have to read and learn until I find the secret button that I press to tell the microprocessor that I changed the oil...or the car could have one less microprocessor and let me change the oil as I always have...or the microprocessor for that function might have failed and the light will never go dark until I pay a Dealership's Ransom for a new microprocessor.

This seems like an awful lot of complaining, but somebody paid $36,600 for this car, and I have less than $3000 in it today. It's going to cost me another $1000 or $1500 to get most of it "right", and that's what I call a bargain.
I hear you! Where vehicles are concerned - the degree of user serviceability, and, often, reliability are inversely proportional to the level of automation -- and I'm just cynical realistic enough to believe that is by design:mad::mad::mad:

Best regards
HP
 

#12

Joined Nov 30, 2010
18,224
they were $250 a piece!:mad::mad::mad:
Sorry. My bad. I misunderstood you.

Even worse, I had previously assumed the transmitter was powered by the velocity of the wheel, like a self winding wrist watch. Unfortunately, that system wouldn't have an inherent failure mode.

If I go somewhere there is an ASE certified Master Mechanic, I don't mind spending a little more for service.
I don't want to hire the last hack that cut my catalytic converter open just because he was curious about what is inside them, so, yes, when I need help, I will pay for it. Meanwhile, I dedicate my life to being self sufficient, but nobody can be good at everything.
 

JoeJester

Joined Apr 26, 2005
4,390
I went to have my battery tested on a 1998 Monte Carlo. The person wanted me to wait 2.5 hours because he didn't know the CCA of the battery and wouldn't test it with his automated tester. He could have said he needed to find out what the replacement battery CCA was so he could test the one based on that, and I would have been satisfied. That venue didn't get my business.
 

mcgyvr

Joined Oct 15, 2009
5,394
I will forever have an idiot light warning me that another microprocessor can't communicate with the tire pressure sensors because I refuse to pay $100 each for a transmitter !
Simple fix.. pull the bulb.. ;)

My last car I bought just so I could learn to work on cars..
The Jeep I bought so I could learn to weld.. :D
Just finished a ton of suspension work on it and the alignment shop was AMAZED at how close I got with a tape measure and a protractor app on my phone to set the pinion angles
I was literally off by .05deg on the toe and caster was dead on..
 

Thread Starter

Hypatia's Protege

Joined Mar 1, 2015
3,228
Another scam. I walked in and said, "Sell me a battery" The Dealership said, "Right after you pay $90 to have this automated tester repeat what you just said."

The rest of the conversation violates the TOS for this site.:mad:
My long standing policy is stay away from dealerships!!! (unless under warranty, or course)
 
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