anyone shed info about HIDs?

Discussion in 'General Electronics Chat' started by raffter, Mar 7, 2008.

  1. raffter

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Feb 28, 2008
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    Hello,

    IS it possible for a DIY HID ballast..etc etc??





    Ralph
     
  2. Papabravo

    Expert

    Feb 24, 2006
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    Is that a Human Interface Device, aka a mouse?
     
  3. Dave

    Retired Moderator

    Nov 17, 2003
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    Isn't HID also something to do with lighting?

    Could be referring to this. Perhaps the OP could clarify this point.

    Dave
     
  4. n9352527

    AAC Fanatic!

    Oct 14, 2005
    1,198
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    High Intensity Discharge. DIY electronic ballast is certainly possible. There are ICs designed specifically for ballast, such as the one from Unitrode. There are also plenty of transistors based ballast circuits out there. A lot depend on your chosen bulb and supply voltage.

    Which tube and what supply voltage are you interested in?
     
  5. Dave

    Retired Moderator

    Nov 17, 2003
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  6. Audioguru

    New Member

    Dec 20, 2007
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    HIDs are those stupid too bright and aimed wrong lights on cars and trucks (SUVs) that blind everybody else.
     
  7. raffter

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Feb 28, 2008
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    @ Papabravo
    "Is that a Human Interface Device, aka a mouse?"

    >>> LOL :D.. no its High Intensity Discharge (HID) ballast...

    @ Audioguru
    "HIDs are those stupid too bright and aimed wrong lights on cars and trucks (SUVs) that blind everybody else."

    >>> LOL :D YUP!! that is the one.. hehehe

    Im about to build one , also to ANNOY those annoying people with HID lamps..dang! about to put it in my bike....
    Been googling a bit.. found some sound info on it.. basically an inverter(+300Vac) or DC... w/c has a starter/trigger (around maybe 2kv??) then when excited, is steadily supplied with +300Vac.. right??

    @Audioguru,
    what do you suppose the bulbs are?? xenon types??

    @n9352527,
    hhhmmmm I think I will have to browse around locally on WHAT type of bulbs they use... iLL post soon..so I could ask what the typical voltage they run from...



    Ralph
     
  8. 0xFF

    Member

    Feb 26, 2008
    12
    0
    "HID" is also a well known "Prox Card" company --> http://www.hidcorp.com/about/index.php.

    It pays to ask your question with as much detail as you can -- to keep us from having to guess at what it is you're asking.
     
  9. scubasteve_911

    Senior Member

    Dec 27, 2007
    1,202
    1
    I would also like to express an annoyance with HID headlights. I had a friend that was obsessed with getting bigger and brighter headlights. He installed an expensive pair with an inverter, and he got honked at the entire time he was out driving. I don't know what possesses someone to think they need such intense lights for regular driving, it seems to be one of those 'compensating' man-hood deals.

    Steve
     
  10. raffter

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Feb 28, 2008
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    Guys,

    Im sort of unfamiliar with xenon bulbs.. kindly check attached... I have been doing some experiments with inverters just tonight... osc @ around 40KHz...that bulb was taken from mini strobe lights(12V).... well it(the voltage sort of ..just arcs.. no LIGHT) does this mean I have low voltage supplied to it??

    how much voltage to "make it light" ???

    or maybe the igniter dont work as expected(no Kv to trigger it)??


    Ralph
     
  11. scubasteve_911

    Senior Member

    Dec 27, 2007
    1,202
    1
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xenon_arc_lamp

    Down the page, it makes note

    Xenon short-arc lamps are low-voltage, high-current, DC devices with a negative temperature coefficient. They require a high voltage pulse in the 50 kV range to start the lamp, and require extremely well regulated dc as the power source. They are also inherently unstable, prone to phenomena such as plasma oscillation and thermal runaway. Because of these characteristics, xenon short-arc lamps require a sophisticated power supply to achieve stable, long-life operation. The usual approach is to regulate the current flowing in the lamp rather than the applied voltage. As an example, a 450 W lamp operates normally at 18 V and 25 A.

    Steve
     
  12. n9352527

    AAC Fanatic!

    Oct 14, 2005
    1,198
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    You need to get hold of the datasheet for the tube. There are several things to take into account, the first is the strike voltage, and then the main discharge voltage, where the current starts to increase. Then, the current peaks. The impedance of the tube varies greatly in different phases of operation.

    If the tube striked then died out, then you most probably have enough voltage at high load impedance but not enough power to increase the current at lower voltage and lower impedance phase.

    How much current and voltage you need to provide to light up the tube after the strike depend on the tube. These would be stated on the datasheet.
     
  13. Audioguru

    New Member

    Dec 20, 2007
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    I see HID lights on cars and the light is blue like old mercury-vapour street lights.
    I have never seen a white HID light on a car, but i have seen ads for them and the light in the picture is white they say from xenon.
     
  14. raffter

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Feb 28, 2008
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  15. raffter

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Feb 28, 2008
    113
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    good day!

    I recently brought a 70W Metal Halide (Linear) bulb... its generic and I dont have ANY datasheets whatsoever...

    some info regarding driving this beast??

    I read from this appnote (run from 230VAC mains) that it has a striking voltage of about 5KV and 85VAC(@110Hz) to maintain light.. and needs 25KV for re-strike voltage...

    now I have also came upon a site w/c states that IT could light 35W Halides(with 12VDC) with voltages as high as 350V @ 20Khz...

    now the previous (appnote) stated it should NOT be run with higher frequencies because of mechanical vibration of the bulb..something like that...

    now Im lost ....

    which is which.. I wish to drive this bulb using 12VDC supply.... I can come up with an SMPS based(push-pull) to drive this bulb but dont have clue WHAT voltage/frequency to use....:confused:

    anyone??


    -Ralph
     
  16. D-MAN

    New Member

    Mar 25, 2008
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    0
    hi raffter, I found this schematic diagram of a 12VDC HID ballast, hope it helps you.

    Introduction [SIZE=-1] Here is a circuit that can be used to power a variety of small (50 w or less) HID lamps, as well as (with modifications) fluorescent lamps up to about 40w, or HeNe lasers, flashes/strobes, and neon tubes, etc., from a 12 V car or marine battery or medium-size gel cell.[/SIZE]

    [SIZE=-1] Perhaps the best thing about this circuit is that it can be built with almost all Radio Shack parts. This circuit does require a homemade transformer. This transformer is not hard to make, just a little tedious for hand winding. Because this circuit gives the lamp high frequency AC (except during starting), none of the limitations associated with DC-output supplies apply (i.e., not using certain types of HID's, which cannot tolerate DC operation). [/SIZE]


    http://members.tripod.com/~wvsp/light1.html
     
  17. raffter

    Thread Starter Active Member

    Feb 28, 2008
    113
    0
    Hello D-MAN,

    tried that one too...I guess it WILL light -some other- bulbs....but not this MH of mine...

    Even found a DC metal halide(with xenon gas) 35W bulb while googling.... a DC bulb(w/o electronic ballast)..imagine that...
     
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