Programming PICs

Markd77

Joined Sep 7, 2009
2,806
"Good enough is enemy of the best."
The Velleman may be good enough, if you have a serial port and are happy with the rather limited range of PICs it can program.
The PICKIT2 can program a lot more parts, and is USB, which might not be a consideration now, but your next PC may not have a serial port - mine hasn't.
 

t06afre

Joined May 11, 2009
5,934
Why not just use some 555 timers:D( Sorry could not resist). Well joking aside I would say NO , get a PICKIT 2 or 3, with a demo board. They are often bundled together. Then you have grown out of your demo board. You can build your own trainer.
With a PICkit you can program in circuit so you do not need a ZIF sicket, Also a PICkit unit will give some debugging options, but not for all controllers. The Velleman has no such options.
 
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Thread Starter

Wendy

Joined Mar 24, 2008
23,415
Looks like the debate continues.

http://forum.allaboutcircuits.com/showthread.php?p=16943

I have no idea what I'm after, I'm just looking.

To set a minimum standard, it needs enough pins to run a clock display, and have a row of buttons to set a clock and/or timer.

It would be nice if it were a DIP package, since I'll likely breadboard whatever I do.

A/D converter is nice, but not necessary.

Cheap is good.
 

thatoneguy

Joined Feb 19, 2009
6,359
Take a look at the PicKit2 Programmer, that is one thing nobody that continues with PICs regrets as a purchase for programming. It also acts as a high frequency logic probe with logging to the computer, and a Serial/I2C debugger mode & software.

Then you have the choice of the "Demo Board". The earlier demo board that came with their ICD had everything you are looking for, but isn't in production.

The choices are a couple "Low Pin Count" Demo boards, which use DIPs, have LEDs and sometimes LCDs, and the "High Pin Count" Demo Board, which has a surface mount 44 (or more) pin 18F series processor, and can have as little as 8 LEDs, or as much as an OLED display and multiple sensors.

The total cost for the PicKit 2 and either the low pin count demo board and the basic SMD Demo board is around $60 for everything needed, including a free C Compiler, the MPLAB design suite, and a dozen or more extremely well documented/commented example applications with source code to work with A/D, PWM, Switch Input, etc.
 

jpanhalt

Joined Jan 18, 2008
11,087
Another option is the Inchworm from Blueroomelectronics. Bill is a member of this forum. You can get a professional board, not whole kit, from him for $9.00 USD (it is on his home page). The Inchworm plus has some other features, but I have the older Inchworm and it works fine for me. Both are for ICSP and require a serial port. The latter may be a problem with some newer computers. For example, my ASUS MoBo serial port would not work, but a street USB to serial adapter works fine.

John
 

BMorse

Joined Sep 26, 2009
2,675
I would still go with the pickit 2 bill, it is still very usefull even for some newer uc's that microchip has released as replacements for older ones.... By the time you outgrow any of the uc's it supports you would probably need something like the REAL ICE or similar for something more advanced.... and for $39.00 dollars at digikey, it makes a nice addition to the tool box..... ;)
 

THE_RB

Joined Feb 11, 2008
5,438
Have you considered spending a little bit more, if you go up to $139 you can get an amazing EasyPIC6 development board from MikroElektronica;


I did a review of the EasyPIC6 here;
http://www.romanblack.com/easypic6.htm

You can use the free demo version of the MikroC compiler, it is limited to 2k PIC code but that is plenty for most projects and you can still use MPLAB in assembler if you need larger projects. You can plug any of the 16F 18F PICs into it, and all the peripherals like LCDs, serial, buttons, LEDs etc are already setup for you.

I know $139 puts it out of the price range of most beginners etc but you are probably going to be more of a "power user" anyway, (you are not a beginner on a teenager's budget) so having all those peripherals on board is really well worth the money.

The main criticism I've seen of MikroC and the EasyPIC6 is that it makes PIC development "too easy". :D
 

jpanhalt

Joined Jan 18, 2008
11,087
@RB

Very nice review. I'm almost ready to buy one...

1) Will it work without the crystal oscillators for chips other than the 10F series?
2) I could not find the list of supported devices. Where is it on the home page?

John
 

lmartinez

Joined Mar 8, 2009
224
You can get a bigger BANG for your knowledge:

http://www.microchip.com/stellent/i...Id=1406&dDocName=en539716&redirects=picdemlab

For starts, the following links may assist you on how to write code for the supported microchips by the PICkit 2 programmer. The pickit 2 programmer can program a huge variety of microcontrollers from microchip..........

http://www.gooligum.com.au/tutorials.html
http://www.ermicro.com/blog/?p=875
http://www.ermicro.com/blog/?p=909
http://www.ermicro.com/blog/?p=423
http://www.ermicro.com/blog/?p=820
 

THE_RB

Joined Feb 11, 2008
5,438
PICdemlab is not even close. A breadboard can't compete with having one LED on every PIC pin and one button on every PIC pin, never mind the plugin ports for LCDs etc.

Jpanhalt- Yes the EasyPIC lets you use all osc options. The xtals plug in, so you can change xtal values, and there are jumpers so you can remove the xtal and connect those pins to I/Os instead of xtal. Same with the MCLR pins.

As for supported devices, the EasyPIC6 has a PICFlash2 onboard programmer that is very similar to the PICKit2 (but I dont think it is exactly the same), however it can be updated externally by the windows USB software.

This is a list I found in a Feb 2009 post in the MikroE forum. I'm not sure where it is on
the home page, but I think they have added more devices now like some of the J K PICs. If you have a specific device please ask and I will check my latest install of PICFLash2 on my other PC.

PIC10F200
PIC10F202
PIC10F204
PIC10F206
PIC10F220
PIC10F222

PIC12F508
PIC12F509
PIC12F510
PIC12F609
PIC12HV609
PIC12F615
PIC12HV615
PIC12F629
PIC12F635
PIC12F675
PIC12F683

PIC16F54
PIC16F57
PIC16F59
PIC16F72
PIC16F73
PIC16F74
PIC16F76
PIC16F77
PIC16F83
PIC16F84
PIC16F84A
PIC16F87
PIC16F88
PIC16F505
PIC16F506
PIC16F610
PIC16HV610
PIC16F616
PIC16HV616
PIC16F627
PIC16F627A
PIC16F628
PIC16F628A
PIC16F630
PIC16F631
PIC16F636
PIC16F639
PIC16F648A
PIC16F676
PIC16F677
PIC16F684
PIC16F685
PIC16F687
PIC16F688
PIC16F689
PIC16F690
PIC16F716
PIC16F737
PIC16F747
PIC16F767
PIC16F777
PIC16F785
PIC16HV785
PIC16F818
PIC16F819
PIC16F870
PIC16F871
PIC16F872
PIC16F873
PIC16F874
PIC16F876
PIC16F877
PIC16F873A
PIC16F874A
PIC16F876A
PIC16F877A
PIC16F882
PIC16F883
PIC16F884
PIC16F886
PIC16F887
PIC16F913
PIC16F914
PIC16F916
PIC16F917
PIC16F946

PIC18F242
PIC18F248
PIC18F252
PIC18F258
PIC18F442
PIC18F448
PIC18F452
PIC18F458
PIC18F1220
PIC18F1230
PIC18F1320
PIC18F1330
PIC18F2220
PIC18F2221
PIC18F2320
PIC18F2321
PIC18F2331
PIC18F2410
PIC18F2420
PIC18F2423
PIC18F2431
PIC18F2439
PIC18F2450
PIC18F2455
PIC18F2458
PIC18F2480
PIC18F2510
PIC18F2515
PIC18F2520
PIC18F2523
PIC18F2525
PIC18F2539
PIC18F2550
PIC18F2553
PIC18F2580
PIC18F2585
PIC18F2610
PIC18F2620
PIC18F2680
PIC18F2682
PIC18F2685
PIC18F4220
PIC18F4221
PIC18F4320
PIC18F4321
PIC18F4331
PIC18F4410
PIC18F4420
PIC18F4423
PIC18F4431
PIC18F4439
PIC18F4450
PIC18F4455
PIC18F4458
PIC18F4480
PIC18F4510
PIC18F4515
PIC18F4520
PIC18F4523
PIC18F4525
PIC18F4539
PIC18F4550
PIC18F4553
PIC18F4580
PIC18F4585
PIC18F4610
PIC18F4620
PIC18F4680
PIC18F4682
PIC18F4685
PIC18F6310
PIC18F6390
PIC18F6410
PIC18F6490
PIC18F6520
PIC18F6525
PIC18F6527
PIC18F6585
PIC18F6620
PIC18F6621
PIC18F6622
PIC18F6627
PIC18F6680
PIC18F6720
PIC18F6722
PIC18F8310
PIC18F8390
PIC18F8410
PIC18F8490
PIC18F8520
PIC18F8525
PIC18F8527
PIC18F8585
PIC18F8620
PIC18F8621
PIC18F8622
PIC18F8627
PIC18F8680
PIC18F8720
PIC18F8722

Also the EasyPIC can be used as ICSP to program PIC on other boards, AND it now has a ICD connector so you can program the PIC on the EasyPIC board with an EXTERNAL ICSP/ICD like a PICKit2 if you would so wish.
 

retched

Joined Dec 5, 2009
5,207
Placing my order. The available add ons are also so inexpensive, i cant see going another route. The eeprom and flash memory card ad-ons are under $10 for eeprom and under $20 for flashmemory card, And you can incorporate them into stand alone projects. The sheer volume of buttons/led/lcd/programmer(all three)/and all other components would cost you more alone. Think of the time savings alone! How long does it take for you to multiplex a 4x4 button matrix on a breadboard alone? The amount you would spend in components and connecting jumpers (on a bid enough breadboard) alone more than pay for itself. And with a pickit2 you still have to get a development platform.

Not to mention how cool it looks on romanblack.com.:cool:
 
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lmartinez

Joined Mar 8, 2009
224
EasyPic6 Development System:

Too fancy for a beginner in uC, no opportunities to utilize other electronic components such as a 555 timer.
 

maxpower097

Joined Feb 20, 2009
816
I'm with RB on this one. BigPic6 is a nice dev board. On the other side I highly recommend on of these big boards for beginners so you can see how everything is connected and working.
 

SgtWookie

Joined Jul 17, 2007
22,230
Bill, don't go with that Velleman programmer; it won't support many of the newer uC's that Microchip has out.

I think you could have a lot of fun with even a PICkit 1, and they're only about $35 + shipping. That limits you to 14-pin PICs, but you'd be surprised what you can do with even 8-pin PICs. I've had a PIC12F675 sitting in a PICkit 1 flashing a dozen LEDs in random patterns for a year now - just using four I/O pins. That doesn't even scratch the surface of what these things can do.

But if you really want to build a clock with an LCD display, you could get a PICkit 2 Debug Express for $49+shipping from Digikey, Mouser, and many other places. It comes with a PIC16F917 mounted on a dev board, and that PIC has built-in functions to handle LCD displays - along with many other features.

Don't discount the "little" PICs, like the 10F and 12F series.

The biggest hurdle is the learning curve for programming the things. Once you get over that, you'll be amazed at what you can do with so few parts.
 

t06afre

Joined May 11, 2009
5,934
But if you really want to build a clock with an LCD display, you could get a PICkit 2 Debug Express for $49+shipping from Digikey, Mouser, and many other places. It comes with a PIC16F917 mounted on a dev board, and that PIC has built-in functions to handle LCD displays - along with many other features.
Don't discount the "little" PICs, like the 10F and 12F series.
The biggest hurdle is the learning curve for programming the things. Once you get over that, you'll be amazed at what you can do with so few parts.
I think Bill should pic up PICkit 3 then he can breadbord his first trainer/demo board using a PIC16F917, or a PIC18F45k20. Microchip provide schematics for all their demo boards. And they are very simple. It is just a pot, a switch and some LEDs.
 

t06afre

Joined May 11, 2009
5,934
Have you considered spending a little bit more, if you go up to $139 you can get an amazing EasyPIC6 development board from MikroElektronica;
The main criticism I've seen of MikroC and the EasyPIC6 is that it makes PIC development "too easy". :D
I think this unit is very good for educational use. But not so good then you shall make your own projects. And the list of supported uCs is small compeared to a PICkit 3. And how about support for newer uCs and incircuit debugging?
 
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